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Advise sought on liability

Charles Hamilton

Charles Hamilton

Joined
Feb 23, 2025
Messages
6
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4
Location
Lake Stevens, Washington
Hi All,

I am new to the forum and having posted in the Introductions. But, to set the stage for this post, I am working on some bowls and platters, most of which I plan to sell or otherwise part with. My wife and I were having a conversation about food safe finishes, and that quickly went into liability in the event someone becomes ill after eating from a bowl I made. Sorry for bringing this topic up, but it seems important. I would like to hear from you, especially those of you who sell, how you have dealt with this topic. For instance, do you have insurance? If so, what type of coverage, and from who? On things like food safe finish, do you use commercial finishes? And, do you get the documentation from the supplier to back up the claim of food safety? These are things of concern to me. Anyway, if you have advice, please share it. Just a bit about me, I am retired, I work out of my home, and I have to be mindful of a budget.

Thanks,
Chuck Hamilton
 
There's a ton of threads on this that you'll be able to find with the search function.
There's a million and three opinions on the topic. I generally use something like tried and true danish oil. Supposedly food safe. I sell a few bowls now and then but if I had to consider carrying insurance to protect myself I think I'd just quit.
According to the wood biologist Dr Seri Robinson there is no food safe finish. Any finish you use will be able to trap bacteria in the wood and nullify the natural microbe killing property of wood.
I tend to avoid anything film finish for utility items, it's going to look like crap after a few uses.
 
This is a really good question. I'm also new to the forum, so I haven't had the chance to explore the hundreds of topics supported here. But I'll be heading to the search engine to find more on this topic.
 
Thank you for your replies. I read the article by Seri Robinson, which is in the November/December 2024 issue of Fine Woodworking. So, very recent. Basically, she says the best finish may be no finish at all. She gives the scientific reasoning behind it. That's helpful. She also points out various wood species that are suitable for food use, mostly lighter woods like maple and birch, which we have plenty of here in the Pacific Northwest. Anyway, it's a good read.

Thanks again,
Chuck
 
According to the FDA curing finishes, like oil, poly, lacquer etc are food safe when cured. That is your “insurance coverage”. The sniff test is good for knowing if the finish is cured.

For anything where metal utensils will be used, I use an oil finish as it cures soft and wont look as bad after use. All other food contact items I use ply thinned 1:1, flood on, keep wet 20-30 minutes, dry off.

This is worth reading:

store.popularwoodworking.com

Flexner on Finishing: The Folly of Food-Safe Finishes Digital Download

Flexner on Finishing: The Folly of Food-Safe Finishes Digital Download
store.popularwoodworking.com store.popularwoodworking.com
 
The notion of a food safe finish has become “valid” simply through insinuation and repetition. If one finish is food safe, then the others must not be, and if you see it often enough, you begin to think there must be some merit to the claim. The reality is no manufacturer goes to the expense of testing for food safety of their products unless required by law (like automobile standards or pharmaceuticals). There is no legal "food safe" definition other than some 'generally accepted' guidelines for food safe finishes outlined by the FDA. These boil down to,
  1. Any resinous or polymeric coating applied over a suitable substrate (i.e. wood, metal, plastic)
  2. Cured by oxidation, polymerization, condensation or cross-linking without oxidation
  3. Made from ingredients generally regarded as safe in food
  4. Or made from a list of ingredients (about 15 pages long) usually used in making resinous or polymeric coatings
The problem in deciphering these regulations is that you have to have some chemical background to understand the terms and how they are used. For example, despite the name polyurethane is not made from urethane monomers. Any wood finish that falls within the generally accepted guidelines for food safety is considered “food-safe”. Doug's sniff test if really the only insurance you need.
 
Charles, tell them what the finish is but make no claims at all about being food safe. When you say something “is”, it can bite you. I have never heard of anyone making making a claim against a turner but…
 
Thanks all. I'll read the Flexner article mentioned, mainly for my own edification. And, to Jerry's point, I won't make any claims about food safety. I'll simply say what the bowl, platter, etc. is made of, and what the finish is. That's what I've done all along.

Chuck
 
If you are in business it is a good idea to have insurance. Talk to your lawyer and an independent insurance agent to see what your exposure is and how to mitigate it. Lawsuits for illness from ingesting "unsafe" finishes used on bowls are probably the very least issue a turner would have to worry about. If a customer trips and breaks a leg on your property with only homeowners' insurance, or a child pulls down your craft show display on its head, now you should be worried.
 
I would think some of the professional wood turners who make a living at this would be a good source for your question.
Say for instance Richard Raffin , Glen Lucas, Mike Mahoney etc... From what I understand is these turners have made a living off of selling their wood turnings. Probably a touchy subject though.
JMO.
I would also be interested on what they would have to say.
 
Thinking about liability can drive one batty. If you have enough assets to make it worthwhile for someone to sue you then you need to talk with both a lawyer and insurance agent. You'll need both general business liability (for when someone trips over your power cord or drops your display on themselves) and product liability for when someone claims your bowl poisoned them. You should probably also form your business as at least an LLC, if not a corporation (hence the conversation with the lawyer).

If you're fortunate enough to have enough assets to be worth suing you might want to reconsider selling your work; unless you are very good and/or prolific giving it away may well cost you much less and your personal liability umbrella coverage will protect you at a fraction of the cost.

Or, you could just not worry about it, which is going to work almost all the time. I suspect the risk of a product liability suit is so low that it makes little sense to purchase that expensive coverage. Business liability at something like $1000/year is more likely to be needed and worthwhile-- and may well be required by event organizers if you're doing events like craft shows.
 
Roger Wiegand said:
unless you are very good and/or prolific giving it away may well cost you much less and your personal liability umbrella coverage will protect you at a fraction of the cost.
Click to expand...
After researching this subject I found even if you give away your items (except to family, one would think it would be OK?) you are still subject to law suits.
I frown on signing any of my work for that reason, it ties you to the piece with a signature. This may be petty but when it comes to settlements, you can't deny it if you signed it pretty much.
 
How about a warning label on your turnings similar to what's required in California:
"This product contains chemicals that may cause cancer, birth defects, reproductive harm, etc, etc".

A sad thing about the legal system is anybody can sue anybody for any reason. And if you are sued you have to defend yourself by hiring a lawyer no matter how silly the case against you might be.

My experience has been if you need to hire a lawyer go with an older experienced one. Do not hire a young aggressive lawyer who will want to get into court and strut his stuff. The older ones are more likely to pursue mediation. As our lawyer told me in my first lawsuit, we don't want to go to court because you can never predict with any certainty how a jury will rule.
 
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