Where have the wide spindle gouges gone?

[waltc]

A year or two ago, I treated myself to a new spindle gouge, 3/4" with a fairly flat radius (sweep?). I want another, and can't seem to find one in catalogs. Almost all are milled from bar stock, like bowl gouges.

Why the change? Do they work better?

Anyone know of a source of the "good old wide chisels?"

I feel like a neanderthal.

Walt C

 

[George Guadiane]

A year or two ago, I treated myself to a new spindle gouge, 3/4" with a fairly flat radius (sweep?). I want another, and can't seem to find one in catalogs. Almost all are milled from bar stock, like bowl gouges.

Why the change? Do they work better?

Anyone know of a source of the "good old wide chisels?"

I feel like a neanderthal.

Walt C

Could you post an image of the profile? might be a help.

 

[Donna Banfield]

Is this what you were thinking of? Packard carries this in the 3/4" and 1" gounge, M2 steel.

http://www.packardwoodworks.com/Mer...creen=PROD&Product_Code=100192&Category_Code=

 

[Brian Myers]

Or these......http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=43177&cat=1,330,43164,43175

 

[MichaelMouse]

I"ve got the Taylor gouges from Lee Valley, and three/four years in on 'em. They're what a gouge should be, in HSS. Still have my shortie carbon set too, and had best get off my duff and get another before carbon steel exits.

Now, if you're interested in a bigger gouge, try this. http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/...op&Product_Code=IT-MARIO125&Category_Code=WIP

Someday.

 

[George Guadiane]

You guys all posted links to the kind of gouge I was thinking of, I guess I was being too cautious - I don't like sending people on goose chases.

I"ve got the Taylor gouges from Lee Valley, and three/four years in on 'em. They're what a gouge should be, in HSS. Still have my shortie carbon set too, and had best get off my duff and get another before carbon steel exits.

Now, if you're interested in a bigger gouge, try this. http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/...op&Product_Code=IT-MARIO125&Category_Code=WIP

Someday.

I buy my antique carbon steel gouges and chisels at garage sales and flea markets (and on eBay). I just sold most of a set of deep fluted Sorby Kangaroo gouges on eBay recently, myself - I actually had too many. There will be carbon chisels for decades to come if you look in the right places (IMHO).

 

[Ed_McDonnell]

As a new turner I'm left wondering why you would want carbon steel instead of High Speed Steel.

Ed

 

[George Guadiane]

As a new turner I'm left wondering why you would want carbon steel instead of High Speed Steel.

Ed

Carbon is just like an old friend to guys like me. It takes an excellent edge. Doesn't hold it as long, but if you don't mind sharpening a little more often...
They are also frequently made from heavier stock... Heavy tools seem smoother to me.

 

[john lucas]

Try one of the Thompson Tools. He makes several styles of spindle gouges. They are state of the art metal and hold an edge for a very long time. They get quite sharp if you touch them up with diamond hones.
www.thompsonlathetools.com

 

[MichaelMouse]

As a new turner I'm left wondering why you would want carbon steel instead of High Speed Steel.

Ed

Because they're a faster hone, actually. You can use diamonds on HSS, but with softer carbon you can use stones and slips of nearly any grit. If you work direct from the wheel, probably not that much difference.

Heat isn't a big deal the way I turn, so the edges are normally dulled by abrasion from minerals in the wood or corrosion. Since they work their worst the same on either alloy or carbon, and the carbon tunes back up easier, makes it my choice for the final two passes.

 

[Michael Kuehl]

Interesting coincidence. I was at a demonstration today by an English turner representing Sorby tools, and he bemoaning the absence of his favorite spindle gouge for doing eccentric turning ( He was hawking the Sorby eccentric chuck, among other tools). He referred to the gouge as a "Continental" or "German" gouge. And now here I see several variations on what he apparently was talking about.

 

[waltben]

The original question was . . .

about the change in spindle gouge profiles. I've got several of the old kind, but I recognize the new ones as being like those used in Europe and for both spindle work and bowl work. I've not used one myself, but have seen demos of them.

As to the new direction the thread has gone,I strongly recommend a new turner never settle for less than M2, since they usually have little understanding of when a tool needs sharpening and don't know much about how to do that anyway. M2 will hold an edge for a newbie to at least finish a piece and then figure out how to sharpen their tools.

For my own use, I personally hate turning around every fifteen minutes to sharpen a tool (my grinder is in back of me when I'm turning) and have settled on either 2040, powdered PM, or Kyro tools. I've found the harder ones seem to take to much work to sharpen and hone. I've two 1/2" bowl gouges for each of my lathes in this hardness. With a typical large dry bowl blank (16 - 20"), I can rough turn, fine turn, make the foot and reverse the piece without stopping to sharpen anything.

 

[Don O. Jr.]

Forged Gouge

Hey Walt, I think you are looking for a forged gouge or "Continental" gouge. Craftsman used to carry them in their catalog (and stores back in the day) and Benjamin's Best has them very inexpensive in HSS. These gouges are hot forged from flat bar stock not ground from round bar stock. They have been around for a long time and seem to be coming back into fashion of late. They can be very versatile.

 

[Paul Engle]

Look for " German style " spindle gouge, I have a 3/4 and 1/2 and they work very well for loooonngggg gentle curves. Good for roughing turned on its side and shear scraping as well as using the bevel to shape.Some what more forgiving than traditional sg.

 

[Malcolm Smith]

In hard steels, tools made from flat instead of bar stock such as roughing gouges are more subject to breakage at the thin point were the blade meets the handle. This can be dangerous as the cutting part of the tool becomes a projectile. I suspect this is the reason there are fewer of them on the market.

Malcolm Smith.

 

[Claude]

A year or two ago, I treated myself to a new spindle gouge, 3/4" with a fairly flat radius (sweep?). I want another, and can't seem to find one in catalogs. Almost all are milled from bar stock, like bowl gouges.
Anyone know of a source of the "good old wide chisels?"
...
Walt C

I know for a fact that they are still on the Hamlet catalogue.
ref: HTC 070 19 mm

 

[jffink]

Ashley Iles also makes continental gouges. The "Tools for Working Wood" catalog (www.toolsforworkingwood.com) that I received today lists them in 1/2", 3/4", 1", and 1-1/4".

I ordered a small Ashley Iles roughing gouge (and some other small stuff) from these folks recently, and the transaction went very smoothly.
Regards, John

 

[Dick Latshaw]

Ashley Iles also makes continental gouges. The "Tools for Working Wood" catalog (www.toolsforworkingwood.com) that I received today lists them in 1/2", 3/4", 1", and 1-1/4".

I ordered a small Ashley Iles roughing gouge (and some other small stuff) from these folks recently, and the transaction went very smoothly.
Regards, John

Joel and his company are considered to be a quality operation on the various 'flat wood' forums. I have dealt with them in the past and have been very satisfied.

Regards,
Dick

 

[Petteri Leppikallio]

I remember seeing Glaser tool in some picture which was like "continental spindle gouge". However it was milled from round bar. Does anyone know this? Is there anything similar around (with more potential tang)?

 

[MichaelMouse]

I remember seeing Glaser tool in some picture which was like "continental spindle gouge". However it was milled from round bar. Does anyone know this? Is there anything similar around (with more potential tang)?

There are some Austrailian gouges which are uniform in thickness as are forged types, but with fat tangs. You could use them if it bothers you. http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&cat=1,330&p=49138

Of course, if you cut properly with minimum overhang, there's little stress on the tang anyway, given the mechanical advantage. Couple this with the presentation where the stress is across the broad section of the tang rather than the narrow, and you can work with very little stress, as this fat guy is doing.
http://s35.photobucket.com/albums/d160/GoodOnesGone/?action=view&current=DontDoThis.flv

Was a better trick 15 years and thousands of sharpenings ago when the metal section was longer, but it still works.

 

[Peter Skellenger]

powder metal bliss

I would second John Lucas on the Thompson tools...although I don;t actually have any Thompson tools! I do have similar tools made by Jerry Glaser (the older red handle tools). I picked these up as new old stock maybe 2 months ago and cannot get over how incredible powder metal is. I have carbon steel tools, M2 HSS tools, 10V (A11), and 15V powder metal tools. The latter are both Glaser tools... Thompson tools are all A11 I think. 15V is kind of overkill really.... I only use this gouge for roughing out bigger bowls (3/4 deep V bowl gouge) so its not generally on the bench. The 10V (A11) tools are my favorite tools for sure. I use them all the time. As for holding an edge and carbon steel.... it is true that carbon steel being softer will sharpen up easier but will dull MUCH faster than HSS or powder metal steel. It will also rust. Carbon steel is a fine tool IMO but pick up a hone and keep it right in reach and use it often and powder metal rarely sees the grinder. I have not ground a gouge in probably 4-5 weeks.... not once and I use them every day of the week! I bought a hone and the grinder just sits there useless! I use a lot of HSS tools too and they are the same way. I hone often. it takes maybe 6 seconds to quickly run the hone across the edge. I have 2 hones, One is diamond and was about 10 bucks. Its xtra fine and worthless. The other hone is a piece of some kind of stone and was maybe 3 bucks at the local industrial supply house. I can shave the hair off my arm with my tools using this thing. The 10V tools are razor sharp with the hone and because they hold the edge so long, honing is a breeze. Just my 2 cents.

 

[Malcolm Smith]

Jerry Glaser is retired but it's my understanding that the Glaser tools are to be made by someone else. Working in tropical hardwoods, I particularly appreciate the Vanadium steel that they are made of. The black ones have a higher vanadium percentage and are considerably harder (also more expensive). He only made them in the larger sizes as there was a possibility of breakage in the smaller sizes which were only available in the steel with less vanadium. These have red handles. There are also softer tools with blue handles. You lucked out in finding them. The weighted handle is also very nice. He clearly gave a lot of thought to the design.

Malcolm Smith.