• April 2025 Turning Challenge: Turn an Egg! (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Kelly Shaw winner of the March 2025 Turning Challenge (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Guillaume Fontaine for "Nebules" being selected as Turning of the Week for April 6, 2025 (click here for details)
  • Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

What is a fair price for these lathes, and this hollowing tool?

Most responses seem to indicate an assumption that the lathes for sale are ready to run. I think that's not the case.



vic.jpg

The picture was taken with a wide angle lens which means what you see as a bent handwheel might just be "fat nose" distortion. Also, perspective distortion could lead one to think that the headstock is tilted to the left and the tailstock is tilted to the right. Or that the stand is trapezoidal shaped … or that the casters are tiny.
 
I sold my 2001 VL300 shortbed with bed extension in late 2020 for about the same price as it took to build it back then. $2900. Pre-covid price inflation/economy tank/political strife... I'd sell for more now.
 
The picture was taken with a wide angle lens which means what you see as a bent handwheel might just be "fat nose" distortion. Also, perspective distortion could lead one to think that the headstock is tilted to the left and the tailstock is tilted to the right. Or that the stand is trapezoidal shaped … or that the casters are tiny.
I thought the same thing, but the fisheye distortion of the lens would cause the handwheel to look tilted 11:00-5:00 (circular path), not 1:00-7:00 like the bottom right of the photo shows. I think it may be damaged. Still worth repairing if the casting is okay.
 
The Vicmarc headstock and tailstock might look small in the picture, they are not. The headstock casting is over an inch wall thickness. I have used both machines, the Vicmarc is far superior to me.
Yes, I went and looked at it today. There is nothing weak about it. The ways are 1 inch thick steel. And as you say, Wyatt, that headstock is as well. I wish the tailstock quill had more than 3.5" of travel, but I suppose there is probably a bigger one available aftermarket. The cabinet underneath is either 3/8" or 1/4" thick steel. And I love how there is a slope of steel underneath the ways that sheds shavings to the back side of the lathe. Really well thought out design.
 
In 2001, I went to the AAW symposium for one day to explore the trade show for the matter of large lathe research. Notebook and pen, tape measure, and caliper were at hand. In 2001, the biggies were Oneway, Stubby, Powermatic, Woodfast, and Vicmarc. (Did I miss anyone? Robust was not yet on the scene, I believe.) In short, Vicmarc had the thickest, beefiest castings of the lot, and the largest bearings (that I could confidently confirm), and so I bought a VL300 off the show floor. Vicmarc was (and still is) the brand of preference of Mike Mahoney, Richard Raffan, and other pros. Vicmarc and Woodfast were the lathes of choice at Craft Supplies' school. Vicmarc's tapered roller bearing are the same type of bearing used on motor vehicle wheels and handle the associated loads of the wood lathe at least as good as, if not superior to, cartridge ball bearings. Their banjo and tailstock clamps lock positively and with authority. And if the relationship between the Australian and American dollar ever improves, maybe we'll see more Vicmarc lathes here again someday.

Powermatic's cast iron legs may (maybe?) give more weight than the shown Vicmarc's steel tube stand, but not necessarily greater strength nor rigidity and stability. Want more mass in any lathe? Sand bags.

And I know I'll catch flack for this, but country of origin is meaningful to me in a great many of the products I buy, and given the chance, I don't want to send my money to Powermatic's country of origin. It's not that I feel the product is somehow inferior (it may, or may not be), it's everything else that surrounds it that I have issues with. But, these are my opinions, with or without merit. It was a sad day when Powermatic (and Delta, and Canada's General) decided to sell it all off because they could no longer compete with their ripped-off clone counterpart machines being made in China and sold at significant discounts. Discounts which are probably not as applicable today.

For all the postings at this board that talk about failed widgets and gidgets on their machinery built in China (some of those parts being quite substantial), I don't see similar posts for machines built in Australia, Canada, and the USA. I'd buy the used Vicmarc VL300, and I back that up with 20+ years of flawless experience with 3 different machines of theirs.
This. How can we not respect the fact that it is the lathe of choice for Mahoney, Raffan, and Lucas? I also really like the idea of tapered roller bearings. And solid steel vs cast iron. Country of origin is a valid point. It's hard to put a price on products that can last beyond a lifespan. Thanks for the firsthand account, Steve.
 
Thanks Steve,
I own a 2007 Vl300, still works as well as the day I bought it. I used it side by side with a friend's Powermatic 4224. The Powermatic may have heavier legs, but it was prone to a lot more vibration than the Vicmarc. And of course because the Vicmarc is mine, and I am used to it I prefer it. I still refer to a Vl300 as a Mike Mahoney lathe.
Ok this point about vibration is resonating with me.
 
My opinion is photographs can make or break a deal. The Vicmarc looks like a well cared for clean lathe in a clean shop. I see just the opposite in the picture of the Powermatic. I agree with those who believe that the Vicmarc is a better lathe than the Powermatic. The Powermatic is a good lathe, but it isn’t top tier. If you want to turn deep hollow forms or coring (especially if using the McNaughton BowlSaver) then I believe the Vicmarc is the better choice.

Given that the Powermatic is over twenty years old and not clean, the absolute maximum I would consider paying is $1K which is about half the original price. Get the Vicmarc if you can negotiate a mutually acceptable price.
I want to turn deep hollow forms and do coring. The vicmarc is 25 years old too. That may mean that I need to replace the inverter sooner rather than later. Hopefully that can be done for $200-$300 if needed. Now, to determine what is a mutually acceptable price...
 
Most responses seem to indicate an assumption that the lathes for sale are ready to run. I think that's not the case.



View attachment 74691

View attachment 74692
I do believe that the comment you made about the tailstock is due to lens distortion. I moved the tailstock quill through its full range of a whole 3.5" and did not encounter any resistance.

Indeed, the casters were probably more useful for moving the lathe into its location than anything else. I can't imagine why they left them on, since the lathe is now only as steady as the lateral tolerance in these weak casters. But as you can see from the picture, it looks like this lathe got minimal use.

I do wonder why the PM cord is cut. I also previewed this lathe today. This gentleman kindly offered to buy a new inverter since he couldnt power it on for a demo. He didn't even ask em to committo a purchase. He just id it, knowing he would need to to sell it. Nice guy.
 
Last edited:
Good observations, @Bob Vaughan, on the possible issues of the two lathes for sale. At first glance I wanted to chalk up the Vicmac tailstock handwheel as a wide angle photo distortion issue, but instead it looks like there could be an issue there needing hands-on investigation. (If the tailstock casting is unharmed, parts from Vicmarc are available and should be discounted off the price of the lathe.) And I bet those casters on the Vic were owner installed for their convenience. I'd remove any casters that were load-bearing the machine in daily use, they won't provide stability no matter how beefy they could be. The PM cord, I agree, but I'd still play dumb/remain silent about that issue until I got my hands on the cord. If my hands and eyes confirm a cut cord (and not just some piece of junk laying across the top of the motor), I'd turn heel and walk out the door with no further discussion.
---------
I've not seen any of Glenn Lucas' videos before today, but it seems he's an avid user of Vicmarc lathes. It appears that he uses the VL300 and VL240. Here's a screen shot (below) of an outside roughed blank on a VL300, captured from this video at 1:07.
View: https://youtu.be/o-Ec2YdB1iY?si=0X4PM0ANOeGYEaHX

He's plugging his signature tools in this video, but there are plenty of shots of the lathes in use, and plenty of other videos as well. Thousands of large turnings come out of his shop, a testiment to the machines he counts on. Even if the Vicmarcs were given to him for free, he would not use them if they didn't provide solid, dependable performance to earn his living upon. New or used, Vicmarc (or Oneway or Robust) over Powermatic for me.
View attachment 74689
Great points, Steve. Also a great video link.
 
Best headstock design, to me, is the Vicmark. It actually tapers in slightly from the bed. This is what makes it so rigid when turning. I am not a fan of all the modern lathes that have bell housings to make removing the headstock spindle, or the "extended" head stocks for "easier access to the bottom of the bowl". What those do is extend your mounting point farther out off the headstock tower, which will induce some vibration issues. With the 3520A, the headstock spindle is flush to the headstock and does not protrude at all.

robo hippy
Good point.
 
I sold my 2001 VL300 shortbed with bed extension in late 2020 for about the same price as it took to build it back then. $2900. Pre-covid price inflation/economy tank/political strife... I'd sell for more now.
Wow, what a deal!
 
I thought the same thing, but the fisheye distortion of the lens would cause the handwheel to look tilted 11:00-5:00 (circular path), not 1:00-7:00 like the bottom right of the photo shows. I think it may be damaged. Still worth repairing if the casting is okay.
I moved the quill through its full range and encountered no resistance. So I think that is a nonissue.
 
So my next question is this: how can I mount the chuck on the outside, for outboard turning? The spindle threads are different; is there an adapter specifically for this purpose? As you can see from the photos, it comes with the outboard turning attachment. But I cant figure out how to mount the check on the outside. Noob question here, but if anyone's done outboard turning with this machine, what spindle adapter would I need to buy to make this work? IMG_5871.jpegIMG_5872.jpegIMG_5897.jpeg
 
Hi Adam, I'm very happy to hear about the non-issue of the Vicmarc tailstock. Phew!

A year 2000 model, only one year older than mine was, and on the factory stand. And 2 years older than my remaining VL200 (same machine, just 16" rather than 24" capacity). Overall, from the photos it's looking very good, but being in the Hawaiian atmosphere, and 25 years old, I think I'd pull everything apart and give all the fitments a good steel wool polishing for the surface corrosion, followed by regular wipe-downs with a quality spray lube/anti-corrosion material like Boeshield T-9. Have the bearings and belt ever been serviced/replaced? If not, that may be warranted by now, too. Purusing the web yesterday for more spindle bearing advice to go along with the Vicmarc video I previously linked, here is a discussion thread from another forum about replacing bearings and bearing races on a 1999 VL300. You may not need to be this intense about it, but it may be a good thread to save.

I can't speak to the electricals, but they are one of those "run 'em 'til they die" sort of things. But, VFD controllers are much more affordable now than they were back then. Is the motor a 3-phase with inverter? Back then, Craft Supplies (not where yours came from, apparently) built them up with Leeson DC motors and drives, I don't know what the Vicmarc factory shipped them with, probably 3-phase with inverter. I do know Vicmarc would love to help you keep that machine in service, so call on them if needed. I'd also ask if a remote on/off/speed control switch is available so you can control it separately from that shin bone/kneecap controller location. The red emergency knee bar shut off is nice to see.

I never turned outboard, so I can't help there, other than offering that the spindle is most likely reverse (left-hand) threaded on the outboard side, so you'd need an adapter for chucks and faceplates. And, chucks will need to lock down into that groove next to the threads with grub screws/set screws on the chuck, to keep it from spinning off while decelerating. The inboard 24" was more capacity than I ever needed, therefore my outboard handwheel had never been removed. Again, I'd reach out to Vicmarc directly if you get no advice here.

From what I've learned from your posts, the Vicmarc looks like a solid contender for you if you're willing to show it a little TLC up front. I can't see why it wouldn't provide another 25 years, or more, of service. Treat it with love and it'll return the favor.

And full disclosure- I only, ONLY sold my VL300 because as I built it, it took up a huge part of my small shop and I wanted the space for other woodworking adventures. And frankly, I hadn't used even 50% of its swing capacity in many years. My smaller VL200 was meeting all my needs, so I found a new, loving home for my VL300 with someone who wanted to turn much larger work than I was doing. Sentimentally speaking, I really do miss having it, but I know it's in a much better home now being used to its full capacity.
 
Yes, I went and looked at it today. There is nothing weak about it. The ways are 1 inch thick steel. And as you say, Wyatt, that headstock is as well. I wish the tailstock quill had more than 3.5" of travel, but I suppose there is probably a bigger one available aftermarket. The cabinet underneath is either 3/8" or 1/4" thick steel. And I love how there is a slope of steel underneath the ways that sheds shavings to the back side of the lathe. Really well thought out design.
Actually, the bed, headstock, tailstock, and toolrest banjo (and factory toolrests) are all cast iron, not steel. But don't let that deter you one bit. Cast iron dampens buzz and vibration better than denser steel. And as far as wear goes, you won't wear out this cast iron.

Look familiar (other than length)? $7600!!
This one also shows a wired remote switch box, probably magnetic, for placement anywhere on the lathe. Maybe they offer it for retrofit? (See their spare parts listings, it's avaiable, but they will tell you if it will work with your older machine.) I always like my lathe controls to the right end of the lathe, away from the line of fire of the wood. I just looked through their complete model line, it seems they no longer have a VL300 long bed, just the VL200 long bed. 2 bed extensions are available for the 300.
 
Looks like changing belt positions may be a petty annoyance on the Vicmarc since access isn't up front like the Powermatic's.

The picture was taken with a wide angle lens which means what you see as a bent handwheel might just be "fat nose" distortion. Also, perspective distortion could lead one to think that the headstock is tilted to the left and the tailstock is tilted to the right. Or that the stand is trapezoidal shaped … or that the casters are tiny.

I'd guess you might need to drop it from a rooftop to actually bend it. (the wheel itself would likely break first)
 
Walking away from the used Powermatic is a good call if you don't have VFD setup experience. The 3520A came with a Delta brand VFD like many of the older Jet lathes. That brand has given many club members fits after it gets some age on it. Somewhere in the archives here there are several discussions about that brand VFD.

The Powermatic would be a reasonable buy at $500.00 for a fix-up kit knowing a new VFD will have to be bought, installed and programmed plus who knows what else.

I'm glad to hear that the Vicmarc's tailstock was photo distortion.

vfd - 1.jpg
 
So my next question is this: how can I mount the chuck on the outside, for outboard turning? The spindle threads are different; is there an adapter specifically for this purpose? As you can see from the photos, it comes with the outboard turning attachment.

My guess is that the threads are for a handwheel. You could ask Vicmarc.
 
I have turned outboard on my Vl300. Mine has a newer spindle design than you have in the picture. I have reverse threaded 1 1/4 x8tpi on the outboard side, so I use my same chucks or faceplate with the lathe in reverse. If that is something you want to do you could change out the spindle. I had to replace my spindle a few years back, it was about $150.00 for a new one. It was not hard to get Craft Supplies had it in stock.
 
Hi Adam, I'm very happy to hear about the non-issue of the Vicmarc tailstock. Phew!

A year 2000 model, only one year older than mine was, and on the factory stand. And 2 years older than my remaining VL200 (same machine, just 16" rather than 24" capacity). Overall, from the photos it's looking very good, but being in the Hawaiian atmosphere, and 25 years old, I think I'd pull everything apart and give all the fitments a good steel wool polishing for the surface corrosion, followed by regular wipe-downs with a quality spray lube/anti-corrosion material like Boeshield T-9. Have the bearings and belt ever been serviced/replaced? If not, that may be warranted by now, too. Purusing the web yesterday for more spindle bearing advice to go along with the Vicmarc video I previously linked, here is a discussion thread from another forum about replacing bearings and bearing races on a 1999 VL300. You may not need to be this intense about it, but it may be a good thread to save.

I can't speak to the electricals, but they are one of those "run 'em 'til they die" sort of things. But, VFD controllers are much more affordable now than they were back then. Is the motor a 3-phase with inverter? Back then, Craft Supplies (not where yours came from, apparently) built them up with Leeson DC motors and drives, I don't know what the Vicmarc factory shipped them with, probably 3-phase with inverter. I do know Vicmarc would love to help you keep that machine in service, so call on them if needed. I'd also ask if a remote on/off/speed control switch is available so you can control it separately from that shin bone/kneecap controller location. The red emergency knee bar shut off is nice to see.

I never turned outboard, so I can't help there, other than offering that the spindle is most likely reverse (left-hand) threaded on the outboard side, so you'd need an adapter for chucks and faceplates. And, chucks will need to lock down into that groove next to the threads with grub screws/set screws on the chuck, to keep it from spinning off while decelerating. The inboard 24" was more capacity than I ever needed, therefore my outboard handwheel had never been removed. Again, I'd reach out to Vicmarc directly if you get no advice here.

From what I've learned from your posts, the Vicmarc looks like a solid contender for you if you're willing to show it a little TLC up front. I can't see why it wouldn't provide another 25 years, or more, of service. Treat it with love and it'll return the favor.

And full disclosure- I only, ONLY sold my VL300 because as I built it, it took up a huge part of my small shop and I wanted the space for other woodworking adventures. And frankly, I hadn't used even 50% of its swing capacity in many years. My smaller VL200 was meeting all my needs, so I found a new, loving home for my VL300 with someone who wanted to turn much larger work than I was doing. Sentimentally speaking, I really do miss having it, but I know it's in a much better home now being used to its full capacity.
Thanks for this thoughtful reply Steve. This is such a helpful online community. You bring up a good point about being exposed to the Hawaiian atmosphere for all this time. A polish, wipe down and T-9 seems best practice. I guess with the bearings I would load them up and see if there's any vibration or noise that suggest replacement? Never heard of a bearing failure but I'm sure if I dig on here I'll find a story or two. I'm not sure how else to assess their condition. I suppose and intermediate step would be to take the spindle off, inspect, and pack some new grease into the bearings? What are people using to grease these bearings?

Thank you for the link on how to change Vicmarc bearings. I'll def save that for reference.

Re: the inverter, yes I suppose run it until it dies. I'll need to research what are the signs of a failing VFD motor. I suppose it can't hurt to check if the motor and /or cord aren't getting hot to the touch due to impedance or something else. Maybe check continuity?

I didn't think to look closely at what motor is on this lathe, but will follow up on that. I assume a 3hp from the factory, but that's def worth checking.

Yes the emergency shut off bar is a brilliant design feature. Perhaps the best safety design feature I've seen to date. Wouldn't hurt to install an aftermarket switch on a magnet for the right side of the lathe.

It appears that both sides of the headstock spindle are threaded clockwise, albeit at a different thread pitch. I assume for outboard this would just mean running the machine in reverse. But it raises the technical question as to how the different thread pitch may affect load tolerance.

I'll reach out to Vicmarc if I get no advice here re: outboard turning with this lathe. But at this point I think I should post a separate discussion about this specific topic.

I get your point about the size and space required for a lathe like this. Prob 70-90% of the time I wont need this much lathe. But it's the outliers that get me, and why I'm currently looking to upgrade. I was hoping to get a sliding headstock so I wouldn't have to lean over the ways for bowls. It does get tiring. But alas, no one lathe does it all, I suppose. Especially at my price point.

Thank you again for your thoughtful replies and research. This is such a helpful online community and I really appreciate being a part of it.
 
Walking away from the used Powermatic is a good call if you don't have VFD setup experience. The 3520A came with a Delta brand VFD like many of the older Jet lathes. That brand has given many club members fits after it gets some age on it. Somewhere in the archives here there are several discussions about that brand VFD.

The Powermatic would be a reasonable buy at $500.00 for a fix-up kit knowing a new VFD will have to be bought, installed and programmed plus who knows what else.

I'm glad to hear that the Vicmarc's tailstock was photo distortion.

View attachment 74739
The gentleman offering the Powermatic is a good guy. He makes jewelry boxes for a high end retailer here, and I believe he just got away from turning as he got older. Regardless of whether or not I buy, when he noticed it wasnt running he took the initiative to buy a new inverter ($323) and he will be having his son or his neighbor electrician do the programming. His asking price is closer to what others have mentioned earlier in the thread. That said, after all this helpful discussion I am strongly leaning towards the Vicmarc if I can get to a price I can afford.
 
My guess is that the threads are for a handwheel. You could ask Vicmarc.
Yes, it appears that way. What I can't figure out is whether those threads can handle the load of an outboard 24"+ turning. I don't understand how this lathe can use the included outboard turning kit (see photos above) otherwise, since the headstock cannot rotate. I'm going to open a separate thread on this topic, and will also reach out to Vicmarc to be sure.
 
I have turned outboard on my Vl300. Mine has a newer spindle design than you have in the picture. I have reverse threaded 1 1/4 x8tpi on the outboard side, so I use my same chucks or faceplate with the lathe in reverse. If that is something you want to do you could change out the spindle. I had to replace my spindle a few years back, it was about $150.00 for a new one. It was not hard to get Craft Supplies had it in stock.
Ooooh, now we're talking! That answers my question, and is probably what Vicmarc will tell me. Good to know these exist, thanks Wyatt.
 
You're very welcome, @Adam Vila. If I had to guess about the outboard turning rest, maybe he used it swung to the right to use as the tool rest on the inboard position. Because otherwise, an M33, or 1-1/4" x 8tpi chuck or faceplate will never thread onto the outboard end of the spindle with those threads, not without an adapter. Of your photos, first message, pic #4, the hand wheel and lock collar are sitting on top the headstock. Here is a pic of the handwheel of my 2002 VL200.
1000011525.jpg
That's blue masking tape wrapped around the 2-piece lock collar, just to keep my fingertips from finding the grooves between the 2 pieces of the collar when I'm using the hand wheel.

If turning the spindle by hand shows the bearings to be buttery smooth, and if you aren't feeling any in/out or side-to-side play when grabbing the spindle from each end, they are probably good. Not to say that after 25 years they couldn't benefit from a bearing cleaning and repacking with high quality wheel bearing grease from an auto parts store... These are, essentially, automotive wheel bearings. A good lithium, or synthetic, wheel bearing grease with a known lubricants brand name should be sufficient. The Vicmarc video stated "lithium auto wheel bearing grease" without being any more specific. I'd have them cleaned out in a parts washer first. Maybe a local car repair shop or similar could run them through their parts washer.

Whatever you decide to purchase, one of these or something else, you've been armed with a ton of good info here to keep you on the right path. Best Wishes!
 
Back
Top