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Trying to get a blue finish with blue dye, tips?

D

Dan Koiro

Joined
Feb 8, 2020
Messages
6
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1
Location
Indianapolis, Indiana
Hello, I'm using a Mixol blue dye on a yellowish wood (Dot Ebony) but the result is a blue-green. I'd almost expect this, considering the slight yellow of the starting piece, so I tried mixing in a little black, but it ends up being too dark, and more black than a deeper blue.

Is there a proven method of getting a blue result with a blue dye? I haven't completed turning, just testing, so I can still do some trial and error.

Letting one coat "dry" and applying a second "coat" doesn't darken the color.

Thank you all.

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I use oil paint thinned with linseed oil and a bit of turpentine. Apply as a wash. Applied with a brush and rubbed in. Takes awhile to dry though.
 
You need to bleach the wood using a mixture of sodium hydroxide and hydrogen peroxide. Here is a link to a tutorial I posted on making your own wood bleach for a fraction of the cost of commercially available wood bleach. Neither chlorine bleach nor oxalic acid can remove the natural pigment in wood.
 
Anybody need some 2 part bleach, I have some, need to give it to someone, pick-up only, virginia south central border with nc, pm me, note should be used with special gloves and face sheild
 
Bill Boehme said:
You need to bleach the wood using a mixture of sodium hydroxide and hydrogen peroxide. Here is a link to a tutorial I posted on making your own wood bleach for a fraction of the cost of commercially available wood bleach. Neither chlorine bleach nor oxalic acid can remove the natural pigment in wood.
Click to expand...
Your article nicely convinced me not to make this mixture Bill! I am one of those guys that should steer clear of caustic chemicals!!
 
Picked up from the Air brush guy at TAW a few years ago. All woods have their own color and if you seek to achieve a specific color then the wood has to be bleached. Bill's article gives you what you need to get there with dye. With wood stains there are many ways to get the colors you want but it is a stepped process with several different products involved. Another thought is that even withinthe same species you can get different shades of the same color.
 
Russ Braun said:
Your article nicely convinced me not to make this mixture Bill! I am one of those guys that should steer clear of caustic chemicals!!
Click to expand...

I might have made my warning a little too scary, but lye (sodium hydroxide) and 27% hydrogen peroxide are two chemicals that shouldn’t be treated casually. Wear PPE because you don’t want either of these chemicals to come in contact with your skin. The procedure for dissolving the lye crystals is very important. Never pour water on the dry sodium hydroxide crystals because that would cause a violent reaction.
 
Bill Boehme said:
I might have made my warning a little too scary, but lye (sodium hydroxide) and 27% hydrogen peroxide are two chemicals that shouldn’t be treated casually. Wear PPE because you don’t want either of these chemicals to come in contact with your skin. The procedure for dissolving the lye crystals is very important. Never pour water on the dry sodium hydroxide crystals because that would cause a violent reaction.
Click to expand...
Bill (or others) - any suggestions for finding hydrogen peroxide at 27-30% ?
I was going to make the mixture about a month ago and stopped at 3 different swimming pool stores and none of them stocked it.
 
I think that most pool supply places use chlorine just because that's how they have always done it ... and chlorine oxidizer costs less than peroxide. You may need to shop online. Google "aqua silk oxidizer" The only issue with buying online is that you might need to buy a case of four one-gallon jugs. Here is one example: PoolGeek
 
Bill Boehme said:
I might have made my warning a little too scary, but lye (sodium hydroxide) and 27% hydrogen peroxide are two chemicals that shouldn’t be treated casually.
Click to expand...
Yes I have had experience with lye getting on both hands and if I am remembering right the resulting pain was similar to the pain of my recent case of shingles. Back in the 1970's I made 4 pair of snowshoes patterned after a WW2 war surplus pair and of course the webbing was all rawhide. The process of making rawhide is to soak a fresh steer hide in hardwood ashes (a great source of Lye) for about a week, which will loosen the hair so it can be easily pulled, but as I learned it should not be done with bare hands.
 
John Dillon said:
Bill (or others) - any suggestions for finding hydrogen peroxide at 27-30% ?
I was going to make the mixture about a month ago and stopped at 3 different swimming pool stores and none of them stocked it.
Click to expand...
I searched high and low locally, including local beauty supply shops, pool supply, DIY stores, medical supply, etc.. I thought I was onto something when I found a hair lightener marked “30”, but 30 means 15%, and their 40 means 20%. They woudln’t sell anything higher than 20% without a license, and it had other agents in it, so I passed. The girl said that taxidermists come in to buy it to bleach skulls, but I’m skeptical that a legit skin stretcher would be shopping for chemicals at a local beauty supply.

After coming up empty on the 27% peroxide, I found that the same DIY store where I bought the drain cleaner also sold the Zinnser kit. I returned the drain cleaner, picked up the Zinnser for $2 more than the drain cleaner, and I think it worked great for my need, I’m just turning a pen, so at the rate I’m going, that $9 kit is a lifetime supply. If I were doing more bleaching, I’d be getting a gallon of 27% online somewhere.

I would’ve been stuck with a green pen if it weren’t for y’all, thanks!
 
The pool supply store in my neighborhood went out of business during the pandemic. I think there might be one or two other places in all of the Dallas/Fort Worth metroplex that that carries the 27% hydrogen peroxide oxidizer. I learned back in 2016 that the stuff used by beauty shops etc, for some unexplainable reason doubles the actual percentage.
 
John Dillon said:
Bill (or others) - any suggestions for finding hydrogen peroxide at 27-30% ?
I was going to make the mixture about a month ago and stopped at 3 different swimming pool stores and none of them stocked it.
Click to expand...
I had a similar experience trying to find high strength hydrogen peroxide. I came up empty at all of the usual locations and got a lot of suspicious looks. A local agricultural supply store said they usually stock it for animal husbandry purposes, but they didn't have any in stock at the time and I never went back to check, or actually saw the product. It may not have been suitable. I was finally able to find some 35% Hydrogen Peroxide at a local health food store. I have no idea what their typical customers use if for. The brand I purchased is Sprout Master (https://www.sproutmaster.com/collections/35-food-grade-hydrogen-peroxide). I have yet to muster up the courage to actually experiment with bleaching wood, but I have all of the necessary ingredients.

One question i have for those who have bleached wood before is: can you double or triple dye after bleaching? More specically can you sandback the earlier dyes to leave the dye in just in the most highly figured spots without sanding through to unbleached wood. I strongly suspect that the bleach effect will be very shallow, perhaps even shallower than the penetration of aniline dyes but I thought I would those who have done it.
 
Adam Cottrill said:
One question i have for those who have bleached wood before is: can you double or triple dye after bleaching? More specically can you sandback the earlier dyes to leave the dye in just in the most highly figured spots without sanding through to unbleached wood. I strongly suspect that the bleach effect will be very shallow, perhaps even shallower than the penetration of aniline dyes but I thought I would those who have done it.
Click to expand...
Yes you can.
You have the concept. The bleach is shallow. The dyes are shallow. Sanding will bring up the natural wood.

I have bleached beads on walnut. The bleach turns walnut a light brown. I have sanded off a bleach spot goof up. It is maybe a 1/32” deep. Maybe a 1/16

Dyes tend to mix especially the alchohol based ones. Put red over green and you get yellow not a layer of red on the top.
Sanding back does not show different colors in dyes so much as showing wood.

I achieve varying colors in dyes by applying different dyes next to each other. A spritz of alcohol will mix them where they meet.
Reducing dye color can be achieved by wiping with alcohol on a makeup sponge. The dye will go into the sponge so you can see more wood. The alcohol wipe greatly reduces the dye but doesn’t remove it all.

Layers of colors are easy to get with milkpaint. These go on in layers. Sanding will show the layers of paint.
 
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