Rumor

[bbergst]

My wife worked the registration St. Paul and had a nice older lady come to the desk stating how much her husband had enjoyed the day after attending three demos. They wanted to come back Sunday and wanted to know about the registration. Spent the whole day thinking it was all free. No name tag and never checked at the door of any demo. Some will find ways to crash the gate , but this couple seemed not to know any better or at least the wife didn't.

 

[John Altberg]

I wonder if one unwilling to pony up $10 for admission is really firmly in the target market of most vendors. Does anyone have any hard data on how many people this will actually impact? The stated purpose of the admission is to pay for advertising within the host city that, heretofore, has not existed. If it works, seems to me that there may be a net increase in attendees to the trade show.

 

[Barry Crowder]

I really don't have a vested interest in this either way, but as far as exposure to vendors' offerings, I'm unlikely to go to a trade show to get my information. I'm just not that kind of purchaser. And I am certainly not going to pay for the privilege of getting information about a vendor's products. Ever.

Since Brent@TurnRobust chimed in, I'll mention that I was quite impressed by his company's lathes when I saw the demonstration that Carl Jacobson did on YouTube last summer. And just 5 days ago, Lyle Jamieson made is own video for the AB on his channel. Reed Gray (hello, sir!) use his for his videos while I don't recall him doing a demo of the lathe, I can still pick up on the lathe in actual use. Same goes for tool rests and other accessories that I see in various videos, and in discussion forums, for that matter.

I AM NOT saying that viewing YouTube videos is a direct substitute for hands-on experience with tools, or for seeing completed pieces, or for hands-on training. But the reality is that there are abundant and free sources on the internet for information. I have seen this Symposium being compared to other trade shows in this thread, but the elephant in the room seems to be that many people, particularly younger people, are getting their information on-line.

I'm also not saying that YouTube is the epitome of woodturning information, because for the most part it is far from perfect (albeit with a few gems thrown in). I am constantly dismayed by videos that I see where the aspiring turner obviously has no understanding of basic things like grain orientation, bevel supported cuts vs. scraping, etc. It's also quite an echo chamber where anyone (for the most part) who offers constructive criticism on something they see in a video is labeled as a troll. But I digress...

I hope that this post doesn't come off as tangental to the subject, but with regard to recruitment, showcasing work, and for knowledge of woodturning tools and accessories, the AAW in general and the Symposium in particular are competing with the internet, which is full of free information, opinions, images, etc. I really don't see how adding an entry fee could do anything but hurt the spreading of information.

And as far as advertising, the 2016 UK & Ireland Woodturning Symposium is mentioned in NUMEROUS YouTube videos. I don't recall a single mention of the 2016 AAW Symposium on YouTube.

 

[Joe Penn]

My wife thought about going for a day to look around. I registered, volunteered for four days since I’m local, and I intend to bring a donation bowl. However, my wife said “after all of that I’m not going to trek downtown and pay. It’s too much to ask.â€

 

[hockenbery]

My wife thought about going for a day to look around. I registered, volunteered for four days since I’m local, and I intend to bring a donation bowl. However, my wife said “after all of that I’m not going to trek downtown and pay. It’s too much to ask.”

Joe,

The significant other of an AAW member can get in for free too.
Since you are registered You can get her a badge when you register so she can roam unaccompanied and attend the craft classes.

The hardship comes in that the guest of a member or volunteer has to go in with the member or volunteer.
However spouses of registered attendees can get their own badge.....

🙂 I would like you to discourage your wife from protesting needlessly. 🙂

Please encourage her to join you and the rest if us.

Al

 

[Tom Albrecht]

Yeo!

While many trade shows do charge admission, most stores do not unless they are a member only store and they are few and 'exclusive'. There is a local Home and Garden show that 'asks' for canned food donations for the local food bank, but otherwise, admission is free. They have, by far, the highest attendance of this type of show in the state. I think the vendor area and gallery should be free to encourage more people to come in and view. This is particularly true for those who are curious, but not hooked.

robo hippy

Robo's right, Brent too. Do you want to be in an "exclusive" organization, or an inclusive one?

TA

 

[john lucas]

by advertising they are simply trying to reach a larger audience. However advertising isn't free. there are many things around Atlanta to see and do but virtually all of them charge. I visit my parents there frequently. Even the art shows that are fee charge for parking. I don't think it's too much to ask the public to help foot the bill if they want the chance to see and possibly buy the latest in woodturning gear. That just may be me but it seems like everywhere I go to do almost anything there is a fee. Heck even the national parks charge fees now.

 

[Joe Penn]

Joe,

The significant other of an AAW member can get in for free too.
Since you are registered You can get her a badge when you register so she can roam unaccompanied and attend the craft classes.

The hardship comes in that the guest of a member or volunteer has to go in with the member or volunteer.
However spouses of registered attendees can get their own badge.....

🙂 I would like you to discourage your wife from protesting needlessly. 🙂

Please encourage her to join you and the rest if us.

Al

Al,

That's nice to know. I have already registered online, so I can get her a badge at the event?

Thanks for the info.

 

[hockenbery]

Al, That's nice to know. I have already registered online, so I can get her a badge at the event? Thanks for the info.

When you pick up your packet ask them how to get a badge for the craft classes etc.
I don't know how you all plan to do it this year.
I don't think there is anyway to register ahead.

Al

 

[Justin Stephen]

I think that in many cases the vendors are actually losing money if you look at just their sales versus expenses. However, in the long term it is hopefully good advertising.

It is probably pretty difficult to quantify sales from a show appearance like that since a lot of those sales do not occur at the show. Between the hassle of stuff you bought into a suitcase which might already be pretty full plus concerns about weight charges for luggage plus the general ease of just having it delivered in a box to your front door, I suspect a lot of sales are effectively made at these shows that don't show up on the vendor's receipts until afterwards. I know I have used the vendor area to touch and feel stuff that I had been considering before but then don't actually make the order until later.

For someone like Brent, this would obviously be even more acute. He may effectively make a sale at the show that doesn't actually result in an order until months later because the woodturner needs to save up some money and/or go to work on his/her spouse to get the necessary permissions in place on the homefront.

If they come out of curiosity to see what strange things that woodturners do, charging admission is probably enough to kill that thought.

This is my greatest concern as well. On the other hand, without some substantial advertising, many of the people who might be curious will never know about the show in the first place. So the ideal situation would actually be advertising plus free admission to the vendor area and gallery. I remember when I first became interested in woodturning. It was at a crafts fair (Sugarloaf in Gaithersburg, MD years ago). We were looking for Christmas presents for friends and one of the vendors was a woodturner. Looking at his work is what got me interested enough to take a class and the rest is history. However, if I had been on the fence about it and saw a billboard for a woodturning show in town two weeks later, you can bet your butt I would have gone to see it if I could have. Personally, $10 admission wouldn't have bothered me but it might bother some people.

What person considering this hobby wouldn't be awestruck and inspired by walking through the Symposium gallery? And then to be able to walk down the hall and see all the cool lathes and gadgets as well? We need to get as many people like this through that door as possible, period. Advertising the show to local folks is critical. Most prospective woodturners are not in a position to otherwise hear about the show through word of mouth, etc.

The solution I would propose is one that some people will be unhappy with but here it is: Keep the gallery and vendor area free and increase the cost attendee admission a little to cover advertising costs. We pay our AAW dues in order to support the AAW mission, a big part of which is growing the woodturner community. I cannot attend the Symposium this year but if I could, an extra $5 would certainly not deter me from doing so considering the $1000 or so I would spend to attend otherwise between admission, airline tickets, hotel rooms, etc.

 

[robo hippy]

The question is what would be the numbers difference? Would more people come if the vendor area and art gallery are 'free'? Advertise it that way, and even ask for donations for the local food bank, which is a great cause, and will bring in more people. Advertising in magazines and other media is expensive. Flyers up in any area that had any woodworking toys is usually free, especially for a non profit organization. From the few Symposiums I have gone to, I would guess that at least 90% of the attendance is destination type where they come by specifically for the event. Almost no casual drop in attendance.

robo hippy

 

[Jay Mullins]

Blinding Flash of the Obvious ( BFO )

I agree with Brent on this. This event is not only for show and tell, it is for recruitment, and added fees make it difficult for many to attend. This is exactly along the lines of the event itself, which is not for those on any kind of modest budget. The convention centers, hotels, and dining places essentially price gouge, which may be fine for big corporations who will pay any fee. If the event is totally about the woodturning industry, then fine, but it is probably more geared to education, which needs to be expanded to bring in more people. I only have a single booth space, and it stretches my budget, and for me it is more of a hobby that supports itself rather than a way to make a living.

robo hippy

I've read most of the comments and so far it seems that everyone is overlooking the obvious.

1. How many visitors are expected?

a. If the normal number of visitors are just a few, then let them in for free.
b. If the numbers are substantial, let them in for free and add $10.00 to the registration fee. Any one that is a woodturner, has: spent a ton of money on a lathe and tools and another $10.00 is nothing. This rumor and concept of charging a few visitors has cost more in aggravation and will be re-couped from a few visitors.

Jay Mullins

 

[Bill Boehme]

There is no normal number of visitors and nobody has tracked any of this. The venue changes every year. Gleaning useful data will not be an exact science.

 

[hockenbery]

There is no normal number of visitors and nobody has tracked any of this. The venue changes every year. Gleaning useful data will not be an exact science.

Some counts were made at recent symposiums. With each venue being different we don't do very good at predicting attendance.
We know where members live. But various predictive models based on population densities don't match historical attendance.
But not enough about which ones will go to the symposium.

There are trends.
Mid Atlantic do well,
Pacific north west good
Mountain time zone, South, south west, New England do the worst.

5 year Anniversary symposiums do well

Be interesting to see how Atlanta does.

 

[Justin Stephen]

There is no normal number of visitors and nobody has tracked any of this.

And it would be a bit of a moot point even if they had been tracking non-attendee visitors in previous years since the point in all of this is to pay for advertising to increase the number of visitors. Whatever the counts were in prior years, the AAW obviously feels like they were too low. In this, I agree with them. The more non-attendees we get through the door, the better. Almost everyone, even locals, who are paying between $325-$360 to attend the full symposium are already woodturners or are already deeply interested in becoming one. These people do not fully represent a growth opportunity for woodturning as they are already in the fold, more or less.

So how do we get more of the rest of the world into the event to check it out and, hopefully, develop an interest in woodturning? Advertising. I'm sure some people might just be wandering by the convention center that day, see the signs, and think, "hmm, that's look interesting, let's check that out", but those numbers will be low. A few well-placed billboards or local newspaper ads could do wonders to introduce the hobby to hundreds or thousands of new people.

The question is: will they be turned off when they get to the door (or see the print on the ad) and fine out that it costs $10? One person probably won't be, but another person with their entire family in tow may very well be. It would be better if it is free, and keeping it free for all also generates a subtle but important undercurrent of accessibility and good will towards those very people that the AAW (and the rest of us as dues-paying members) want to expose to the hobby that we all know and love. So how many will be turned off? No one knows, but I think it is safe to say that the answer will definitely be "some".

I have seen mentioned elsewhere that the gallery will remain free but that the entrance fee is only for the vendor's area. I don't personally think this is good enough. Both offer an "ooh! aah!" experience that is different from one another.

So, again, advertising is a good thing but obviously someone has to pay for it. Personally, I think it should be paid for by slightly increasing the price of symposium attendance.

 

[Barry Crowder]

Missed Advertising Opportunity

If you're interested, try the following. Go to YouTube and search for "UK Woodturning Symposium" and notice the results. You will see a community of supporters, with a common graphic that reads, "I'm Supporting UKIWS". Lots of callouts in videos and links to the Symposium's websiste. This is all free advertising, geared toward a very interested audience (i.e. people that are already interested in woodturning). As far as I can tell the only cost is the time it took for someone to create the graphic and for the organizer to create a video asking for support.

Then do a search for "AAW Woodturning Symposium". I see some gallery posts from previous years, but nothing whatsoever for the 2016 Symposium.

This seems like a significant missed opportunity to me, and given that this thread is about creating a negative incentive for attendance (i.e. increased cost) in order to pay for advertising the event, I cannot help but suggest that AAW consider utilizing this resource. I don't presume to speak for AAW, but it wouldn't take much to reach out to the US woodturners that have channels and ask for them to mention the AAW Symposium as well.