replacing tool rest lock handle, Oneway 1224

[Steve Tiedman]

I really do enjoy my 9-month-old Oneway 1224. Size, power, luxury car ride... Except, I am just not enamored with the U-joint yoke style locking handle for the tool rest on the banjo, not from day 1. If I recall, it is the same style of handle on all of their lathes, but possibly a smaller handle and thread size. The handle is riveted into a yoke which threads into the banjo. Yes, the banjo collar the yoke threads into can be re-oriented clockwise/counterclockwise to suit the user and change the angle the handle hangs at, but I just do not like that loose-in-the-yoke style handle. But I can't help but wonder, why didn't they just spec an "adjustable handle"? These are the type of handle where the handle is attached to a threaded stud, and by way of a spring and gear teeth, the handle can be reset to any different position on the threaded stud. So, I went looking, and found what I hope will be the solution I'm seeking.

2 pics, factory yoke-style handle.




A German company called Kipp makes these adjustable handles (and I get the feeling that maybe they developed this style of handle a long time ago). They are available for a low price ($ teens) with a fiber re-enforced plastic handle, or a mid-price ($ 20's) cast zinc handle, both available on Amazon, Grainger, MSC, etc., or the high price ($30's) with a steel handle that I can only find from the USA rep in Michigan. Establishing that the thread is a 1/2" x 13 thread pitch (after torturing myself to conclude that it could be a very uncommon M12 x 2 thread pitch metric), I found 2 steel handle Kipp versions. I bought this first one below, because other than the silver color, the general shape of it is similar to the shape of the banjo cam lock lever. I could always paint it if I want to. The handle length is a little bit shorter than stock (1/2" or so, no functional loss there), and the threaded stud length is 20mm rather than the 15mm of the Oneway handle, so if needed I'll trim down the stud length, about 3-4mm. The adjustable handle is offset from the threaded stud at 20 degrees, which I mocked up on the lathe with the factory handle, and 20 degrees is about perfect.

Adjustable Handle steel | KIPP USA

Adjustable Handle steel ✓ Made in Germany ✓ Highest quality ✓ Fast delivery ✓ Customer-specific solutions ✓ Download CAD data ✓ Wide range with 75,000 items ✓ Manufacturing expertise ✓ Request a quote ✓ Order online now!

www.kippusa.com

This one below is a bit more streamlined looking, but it came in several colors (plastic, zinc, and steel) like this red (which I was this >< close to buying, just for the splash of color). Maybe if I'm inspired, I'll paint the one above a red color, just for fun. Nearly the same overall dimensions and handle offset as above.

Adjustable Handle steel traffic red RAL 3020 textured matt | KIPP USA

Adjustable Handle steel traffic red RAL 3020 textured matt ✓ Made in Germany ✓ Highest quality ✓ Fast delivery ✓ Customer-specific solutions ✓ Download CAD data ✓ Wide range with 75,000 items ✓ Manufacturing expertise ✓ Request a quote ✓ Order online now!

www.kippusa.com

I'm sure the lower cost zinc version would have been sufficient, but if I can get a lifetime piece made from steel instead, I'm going steel. And shipping was, of course, very non-Amazon-like ($16). $51 total. It should be here from Michigan in a few days, and I'll report back on its success (or failure...).

I did some 'net searching, and I could not find another person who felt the same as I do about that yoke-style handle, nor anyone who ever reported a mechanical failure with it. Here I am again, the odd-man out. But, it just bugs me, and it had to go.

 

[Bill Alston]

We call these “Bristol Locking Levers” over here. Most are cast alloy or reinforced plastic. You can get some made in stainless steel.
I prefer the plastic ones as they seem to be better quality than the alloy ones. This is also represented in the price.

I got my last order of levers from:

WDS Components | Spare Parts | Machine Accessories

WDS Components home of standard parts and machine accessories. Products available with same day dispatch and global delivery. Downloadable CAD models.

www.wdscomponents.com

 

[robo hippy]

Steve, there is one glaring problem, to me, with that style of handle. The set screw that goes against the tool rest post is hardened metal. The handle part, which is spring loaded is made from a MUCH softer metal. After a year or three, the handle will fail due to the differences in the hardness of the materials. I had one that I replaced with a sliding T handle, like bench vices and on standard vices. I liked it a LOT more than the softer ones. I was a production turner, so perhaps my handles wore out more quickly because I was on the lathe so many hours per week. Still, those types of handles are planned to fail.

robo hippy

 

[Steve Tiedman]

Hello robo- similar thoughts occured to me as I saw the choices of plastic, cast zinc, and steel for the handles, which led me to choose the steel handle version. (And being made in Germany, hopefully of higher quality steel, or at least less suspect, than from the Far East. Steel grade for the handle was not disclosed by the mfr.) On Oneway's banjo, there's a formed "bushing", or contact pad, that the threaded stud pushes against the tool rest post. I, being a casual hobby turner, and one who tightens machine fittings tight, yet not overtight (I've seen some gorillas on lathes, drill presses, vises and bandsaws...), I'm confident I'll get a few years out of this new handle. And if it goes belly-up on me, I'll pull the factory handle from the tool chest and put it back in service. We shall see...

 

[Mike Novak]

I upgraded to the oneway banjo a few months ago. My first impression I wanted to hate the tool rest handle, but It’s just so easy to use! It’s extra long, so no force required to lock it, and the yoke is free so it just moves so easily. I expected it would get in the way sometimes, but that hasn’t happened yet.

 

[Stan Pressner]

Just FYI here is the info on their steel:Handle Steel 1.0401, all other steel Grade 5.8

 

[Steve Tiedman]

My search for "German steel 1.0401", it's a general purpose low carbon steel, used everywhere. Also known as 1018 and C15 steel. Easy to weld, easy to machine. Probably just fine for an operational handle on a light duty machine, and I bet it will last the rest of my days. Better than cast zinc or plastic.

AISI 1018 Carbon Steel | DIN 1.0401 | C15| 080A15 - Fuhong Steel

AISI 1018 low carbon steel offers a good balance of toughness, strength and ductility which is the most commonly available grade around the world.Although its mechanical properties are not very unique, it still can be easily formed, machined, welded and fabricated.AISI 1018 steel has excellent...

www.round-bars.com

 

[Bill Alston]

Looking at the OP’s picture again, that original lever looks quite large. I have a Midi lathe with a 14” swing and I’ve not experienced any issues with the stock lever and it’s only 2” long. I use rests up to 12” long.

 

[robo hippy]

I currently have a small pair of vice grips on my Robust. The serrations in the plier jaws match the ribs on the set post/screw almost perfectly. Some one else did this and posted a picture here on the forums. I still like the sliding T handle best. I have almost no experience with the Oneway Banjo. Many do like it.

robo hippy

 

[Richard Coers]

Steve, you are the first person I've heard about that wanted to change from a Oneway lever to that gear tooth registration arrangement. I thought those gear levers were universally hated. Not only from breaking, but also for putting divots in the tool rest shaft.

 

[Bill Alston]

The thing I, and many others like, is that you can adjust the position of the lever. Most seem to be serrated inside giving anything up to 8 or 10 positions? I have some tiny flag style levers and they are hexagonal so offer six positions.
I’ve not noticed any dents in the tool post before, I’ll have to take one out and have a look.

 

[Steve Tiedman]

The one I ordered, in the description it states the "number of teeth- 24". I'm assuming this is the number of positions I can set the handle to.

I've had these on other machines before, always seemed handy and worked just fine. Usually smaller size, and plastic handles, compared to what I ordered.

I hope I hate the color! I wouldn't mind a reason to buy a can of red hammered paint.

 

[Richard Coers]

The one I ordered, in the description it states the "number of teeth- 24". I'm assuming this is the number of positions I can set the handle to.

I've had these on other machines before, always seemed handy and worked just fine. Usually smaller size, and plastic handles, compared to what I ordered.

I hope I hate the color! I wouldn't mind a reason to buy a can of red hammered paint.

More teeth means smaller teeth, and that means less contact area. Don't muscle that new one!

 

[Richard Coers]

I’ve not noticed any dents in the tool post before, I’ll have to take one out and have a look.

Since very few people think I know what I am talking about, here is the tool rest post on my approximately 15 year old Delta 46-460.

 

[Michael Brown]

The important detail I think is that any system designed to hold the tool post should not bed into it. I love that my jet uses the pinch technique with two barrel pins keyed for the post. I have the indexed lever and it grips the post masterfully.

Ymmv

 

[Steve Tiedman]

More teeth means smaller teeth, and that means less contact area. Don't muscle that new one!

Amen to that. Gorilla tactics are not allowed on machinery in my shop.

 

[Bill Alston]

Since very few people think I know what I am talking about, here is the tool rest post on my approximately 15 year old Delta 46-460.
View attachment 70376

Thanks for posting. That looks quite bad. Provided it doesn’t cause any practical issues though I don’t suppose it matters too much?

I’ve designed and made lots of metalwork projects over the years. When it comes to clamping parts I always try to avoid using a screw directly on the part if I can. Sometimes though parts are too small to do it any other way. There are solutions though. I’m a fan of using brass set screws and if that’s not appropriate I’ll insert a copper or brass pad into a component to stop marring.
Before I adopted this approach I did have something get briefly stuck due to the fastener causing a burr.
Having said all that most wood lathes seem to use a screw directly on the tool post? and I’ve not heard anyone voice any issues over it?
I’ll go check my toolpost in a minute.

 

[Bill Alston]

This is the original tool post from my ten year old lathe. It does indeed have lots of small dimples from the screw. Also pictured is the head of the screw. It looks like the screw had a small “pimple” on the end that has flattened under pressure. I suspect if the screw had been completely flat the toolpost would have gone unscathed? Another toolpost I bought some years ago seems unmarked apart from some small dings etc during manufacturing/transit.
In hindsight I suppose I should have checked the screw when I first got the lathe and smoothed the surface.

 

[Darryl Fective]

I currently have a small pair of vice grips on my Robust. The serrations in the plier jaws match the ribs on the set post/screw almost perfectly. Some one else did this and posted a picture here on the forums. I still like the sliding T handle best. I have almost no experience with the Oneway Banjo. Many do like it.

robo hippy

I didn't like how the binder handle stuck out the side of the banjo so far. On a couple different sessions, I moved the banjo and smashed my fingertip between the tailstock and the end of the handle, so I started looking into alternatives.

I really like that the Robust binder is offset and sqeezes 2 bushings together to pinch the tool rest post. It's very solid and effective without wearing the post witht he end of a bolt mashing into it. I ended up modifying them slightly and using a cam-lock type bolt. (like form a mountain bike seatpost binder, but heavier duty) I've really enjoyed the much lower profile binder and quick flip lock/unlock action. It also adjusts easily for slight differences in post diameters.

 

[robo hippy]

The marks in the post bring back memories of my 3520A. The set screw for tool rest height had a brass insert in it. I guess that would not be too difficult to do on most tool rest set screws. Most big box stores have brass rod, you would just have to drill the hole..... Other than the pinch post set up on the Robust and now the 3520C, that sounds like an option that should be offered by the manufacturers. I think the Laguna lathes used to have a pinch post that was from a slot cut in the tool post holder. I do not think that worked well.

robo hippy