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Not So Simple Spinning Top

I made tops out of maple baseball bat blanks. Some what similar to the one that was too big. To spin it, I put the stem between my palms and did a push/pull with my hands. They would spin for a couple of minutes. Round bottomed tops will not spin as long as pointed bottom tops. I did make some where I bought some Delrin, and used that for the spinning point. Worked pretty good, and didn't bother most wood floors. Harder denser wood will spin longer than softer less dense wood. My favorites are 'gasing' tops from Malaysia. They can be 10+ inch diameter and have a metal rim on them. They are spun with a cord that is maybe 3/8 diameter and they have a pad on their forearm to protect it when they throw. Looks like they spin for 5 or so minutes in loose dirt.....

robo hippy
 
These are turned as a single piece, just my own design based on trial and failure. Made from various high density woods. 2 to 3 inch diameters. Run time differs with size and density, three minutes for the smaller and up to 6 minutes for the larger Lignum Vitae tops.
I made two form factors, 1/4” shaft and a smaller 3/16”, each cross drilled for threading the pull string. Each with a rounded steel point.
The little finger spinners also work great.

23918B06-7D52-4153-A952-63DDD422D8CC.jpegCCFABB0E-1D4E-4DEC-937B-17F1C2B028D1.jpeg
 
Thanks Marc, you've given some thought to your tops. So many turning clubs make tops as demos and yet I wonder how many tops actually preform well? You have a great deal of mass down in the base and a thin top. I suspect that steel point really helps too. Something there probably wouldn't be time to do at a demo for an big audience, esp. if your giving them away. Don's idea about the launcher is good too. Again probably not something that can be cranked out quickly.
 
Spinning tops are one of our foundation projects in our high school program, so I've seen a great many highly original top designs. I think one of the most important aspects for a long spin is to have a small diameter stem. When we spin them with our fingers, we're only sliding a half inch or so of skin over the surface. With a large stem, that's a half a rotation, but with a very small diameter, it may be 4 full rotations.

For stability, the mass needs to be low, so as small a stem as possible, and then the body should be sort of a triangle, with all the mass below the equator. One of our club members has made a variety of really original and interesting tops, including some that flip themselves over and spin on the stem. One of his models is a CD/DVD disc with a wood point on the bottom and a stem out the top. They spin well, though aesthetically, they don't appeal to me.

It's been real interesting to see how differently people conceive and execute top designs. Ultimately, how long they spin isn't as important as the creative expression they make.
 
BTW, Michael Hosaluk makes string spin tops as a demo. One of his demo tricks is to make a top and set it spinning, then make a second top and set it spinning before the first one quits. At our workshop, he got 3 tops spinning at once! (the last one was not the most elegant object, unless you like chips and tear out, but it spun)
 
Dean Center said:
Spinning tops are one of our foundation projects in our high school program, so I've seen a great many highly original top designs. I think one of the most important aspects for a long spin is to have a small diameter stem. When we spin them with our fingers, we're only sliding a half inch or so of skin over the surface. With a large stem, that's a half a rotation, but with a very small diameter, it may be 4 full rotations.

For stability, the mass needs to be low, so as small a stem as possible, and then the body should be sort of a triangle, with all the mass below the equator. One of our club members has made a variety of really original and interesting tops, including some that flip themselves over and spin on the stem. One of his models is a CD/DVD disc with a wood point on the bottom and a stem out the top. They spin well, though aesthetically, they don't appeal to me.

It's been real interesting to see how differently people conceive and execute top designs. Ultimately, how long they spin isn't as important as the creative expression they make.
Click to expand...
I agree, Dean. Yesterday I tried to upload a Work document with a diagram/drawing and a number of points for a good spinning top. Couldn't figure out how to do that.
Re: "small diameter stem" - kind of like the small Ø pulley on your lathe gives the fastest speed. Also, I think an unadorned stem (beads, etc.) will allow your fingers to give a better spin.
Re: "mass needs to be low" - a low center of gravity usually spins better. Also, I think if you can have more mass at the largest diameter it will probable spin longer. I haven't yet tried that theory.

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Tops for Charity

Maple tops – textured and colored with acrylics, inks, iridescent, interference, and metallic paints. Every year the New Jersey Woodturners club members make tops and the club sells them at events throughout the year. All proceeds go to the...
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Tops with bases

All of these tops have a matching base – on some the top fits like a box lid (if the diameter of the blank allows for this), and others have the stem fitting into a hole. All the bases have a slight concave surface turned on the underside to...
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When speaking of finger spinners especially, the smaller stem is best, to a point. There is a sweet spot; larger diameter is slower, too small and your fingers don’t get enough grip.

I have to push back on this notion that the center of gravity needs to be low, always. In my experimenting, dabbling, I noticed that with a low disk the edge of the top easily strikes the surface of the launch is a bit off axis, whereas the taller designs can accommodate a 45 degree tilt easily.
The low slung designs can continue to stay upright at a lower speed than the taller tops, but the taller tops, spun with a launcher are beautiful and graceful in operation. The tall top pictured stabilizes such that it’s hard to tell it’s spinning, really looks like it’s standing quite still. It does fall over sooner than many as it slows, although that still takes more than 3 minutes.

1CFA2168-0AE1-408A-8257-5F1D138FAE1D.jpeg

Try as I might, I couldn’t get more than 6 finger spinners going at once (and take the photo)AFD59086-ED8E-4E03-9F5A-783736E00195.jpeg
Last point; The best surface for longest spin times is glass. Interesting to me was how much better glass is compared to ceramic.
 
@Marc Banka. "When speaking of finger spinners especially, the smaller stem is best, to a point. There is a sweet spot; larger diameter is slower, too small and your fingers don’t get enough grip."

I agree, Marc. With a real thin stem your fingers can / will rub together - canceling any speed obtainable ... and it doesn't look good/appropriate either, IMO. I like about 1/8" to 3/16" - with about 5/32" being the sweet spot. I just eyeball it. BTW, I only make "finger" spinning tops - no string or extra parts needed! :)
 
If you are shooting for longest spinning top, balance is critical and the point that the top spins on needs to be precision.
Many of the long spinning tops use hardened precision points like ceramic or tungsten alloy ball bearings. You can
get these in a variety of sizes that can be pressed into a receiving hole in the bottom of the top.
 
Mike Johnson said:
If you are shooting for longest spinning top, balance is critical and the point that the top spins on needs to be precision.
Many of the long spinning tops use hardened precision points like ceramic or tungsten alloy ball bearings. You can
get these in a variety of sizes that can be pressed into a receiving hole in the bottom of the top.
Click to expand...
I've been using thin CA on the end grain lately (before turning the point) for point longevity - I'm hoping.
Even grain density - no small knots or sapwood is necessary for better balance and spinning.
I've used 1/8" ball bearings a long time ago. Too much effort and unreliable adhesion.
Any info or links for the "precision points" you mention? Thanks, Mike.
 
You can purchase a bag of (10) on eBay or Amazon in various sizes.
Just type in any diameter you want 2mm, 3mm, 4mm precision ball bearing and you will get hundreds of matches.
Silicon Nitride, Ceramic, Hardened Steel, Stainless Steel, etc.
 
I do remember a You Tube video where a team of top 'experts' and some engineers each designed tops to see which would spin longest, The top experts had theirs come down to a point. The engineers version had a very slight round on the point. They were mechanically launched, and the pointed one spun longest.

robo hippy
 
Jim Walters said:
Beautiful tops! And 5 minutes is a long spin time. Any idea of the rpm when they come off of the launcher?
Click to expand...
I don't have any of the tops anymore so I dug out the box marked "Spinning tops stuff" and found some parts to finish 2 tops and several launchers.
The 1st step was to get out my optical tachometer and place a small piece of reflective tape on the edge of each top.
The second step was to launch one and try to read the RPM I then got a reading of around 250,000 RPM.
The third step was to wrap masking tape the rim except for the reflective tape.
The fourth step was to launch one, drop the launcher, grab the tachometer, aim and read.
The readings got as high as 3150 RPM and low as 2600 RPM depending on how quickly I could pick up and get a reading with the tachometer.
I had my Sony Alpa 6000 set up to take a video but I can't find the video on the SD card, so will have to go with one .jpg
DSC01551.JPG
 
Don, Thanks for your experimentation. The masking tape may have slowed them down a little, but the 250,000 rpm seems way too high.
 
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