• Beware of Counterfeit Woodturning Tools (click here for details)
  • Johnathan Silwones is starting a new AAW chapter, Southern Alleghenies Woodturners, in Johnstown, PA. (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Jim Hills for "Journey II" being selected as Turning of the Week for May 6th, 2024 (click here for details)
  • Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

Keeping bugs out of freshly cut bradford pear

Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
19
Likes
11
Location
Durham, N.C.
A bradford pear went down last night, so the wood is fresh. Any suggestions of how to keep the insects out of it will greatly appreciated. The plan is to cut manageable lengths then bandsaw through the pith, seal the ends, and set it aside to dry. The main trunk is 12" to 15" in diameter by about 8' long. This will be a lot of good wood if I can keep the bugs out of it.
Thanks
 

hockenbery

Forum MVP
Beta Tester
TOTW Team
Joined
Apr 27, 2004
Messages
8,677
Likes
5,044
Location
Lakeland, Florida
Website
www.hockenberywoodturning.com
Most effective way to beat the bugs is Turn it now over the next 2 weeks either as once turned pieces or rough outs to dry for returning when stabilized

Drying a 15” diameter half log will take 5-8 years or more air drying and most likely crack before it dries
Drying a 14” diameter bowl with a 1.25” thick wall can take 8-14 months


See the thread below. It has the 3 parts of a demo I did on green wood turning.
Powerpoint on wood and how it moves
Video of rough turning a bowl for drying
Video of mounting and returning a dried bowl.

 
Last edited:
Joined
Apr 15, 2023
Messages
49
Likes
35
Location
Stanfeld, NC
Maybe I am just lucky, but I turn a lot of Bradford Pear and have a lot of it sitting around. I don't know why, but I have not had any problem with bugs in the BP. Mine sits outside on a plastic pallet subject to the weather. Ends are sealed with Anchorseal2 and it is split in half to minimize pith and stress. I have never seen any signs of borers in it and some of it has sat for six months before I could get to it.
 
Joined
Jul 19, 2018
Messages
1,720
Likes
2,261
Location
Ponsford, MN
Most effective way to beat the bugs is Turn it now over the next 2 weeks either as once turned pieces or rough outs to dry for returning when stabilized

Drying a 15” diameter half log will take 5-8 years or more air drying and most likely crack before it dries
Drying a 14” diameter bowl with a 1.25” thick wall can take 8-14 months


See the thread below. It has the 3 parts of a demo I did on green wood turning.
Powerpoint on wood and how it moves
Video of rough turning a bowl for drying
Video of mounting and returning a dried bowl.

Why do people seam to think they can dry thick pieces of wood it just does not work. Add to what hockenberry said that it will likely crack it may also rot. Green wood is so much more pleasant to turn anyway. Ankorseal is not meant to seal but rather to slow down the drying process on the end grain to match the side grain and don't forget the moisture must migrate from the inside to an outside surface so the thicker the piece the longer it will take to dry.
 
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
2,079
Likes
1,180
Location
Peoria, Illinois
Why do people seam to think they can dry thick pieces of wood it just does not work. Add to what hockenberry said that it will likely crack it may also rot. Green wood is so much more pleasant to turn anyway. Ankorseal is not meant to seal but rather to slow down the drying process on the end grain to match the side grain and don't forget the moisture must migrate from the inside to an outside surface so the thicker the piece the longer it will take to dry.
I have to disagree and I can send pictures if you like. I have 6-8" thick blocks of soft maple and catalpa that I harvested from the log and they are 10 years old. Not a single crack in them. There are no hard and fast rules about every species of wood. I can also show you the same kind of block that is riddled with powder post beetle tunnels and holes. If I ever intended to harvest wood again, I would absolutely treat it with one of the borax based preventative pesticides. I have been cutting down blocks of wood for 3 weeks from my shed and I shed a tear often as a nice block of maple burl is riddled and ruined by powder post beetle. I burnt about 2,000 board feet of several species I had stored in a shed on the family farm. 2"x20"x10' long curly maple went into the bonfire. The walnut and catalpa were the main species that survived.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
716
Likes
520
Location
Lummi Island, WA
I agree with Richard - except that you don’t need to buy prepared pesticide, just get plain boric acid, mix a cup in a gallon of warm water and mix. If mold is a problem, substitute a quart of 10% peroxide for a quart of the water (1qt 10% peroxide and 3 qt water with the cup of boric acid powder). Here in the damp Pacific Northwest, mold can be a problem with drying green woods, as are bugs at times. This solution takes care of both issues extremely well. It is very low toxicity and safe to use around pets and kids in these low dilutions - probably safer than chlorine bleach and it actually kills both molds and bugs.
I’ve used this for decades - it works and is really cheap to keep a spray bottle around. I spritz my dry blanks now and again just to keep them bug and mold free.
If you’re treating for mold by including peroxide in the mix, the solution will only be full strength for about 4 hours, so mix it fresh for mold issues. The solution still works for bugs though, so still useful.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Messages
1,080
Likes
1,591
Location
Rainy River District Ontario Canada
You do not need to use these hazardous products, just do as was mentioned, just turn the green wood and let dry slowly, I use brown paper bags for that.

As for trying to dry thick wood or half/whole logs, it will split guaranteed, except for one or two species that are able to dry without splitting, Catalpa is one of them.

But why would u wait for years to dry it (if it would work) rather than just a couple of months to a year, with a much better chance to have a good outcome.
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
716
Likes
520
Location
Lummi Island, WA
Leo, I greatly respect your experience in many areas, but ‘hazardous products’ really doesn’t apply here. https://basstechintl.com/blog/chemical/5-interesting-facts-boric-acid/
We may be put off by the word acid, but it’s hardly dangerous stuff unless you decide to eat a ton of it or use it completely irresponsibly, but then table salt will kill you in equal quantities, and we put acetic acid (vinegar) in our food. In the quantities we’re discussing it’s safe to use around kids and pets, it keeps bugs at bay and will keep mold from growing. It is a completely natural pesticide/fungicide.
 
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Messages
1,080
Likes
1,591
Location
Rainy River District Ontario Canada
Leo, I greatly respect your experience in many areas, but ‘hazardous products’ really doesn’t apply here. https://basstechintl.com/blog/chemical/5-interesting-facts-boric-acid/
We may be put off by the word acid, but it’s hardly dangerous stuff unless you decide to eat a ton of it or use it completely irresponsibly, but then table salt will kill you in equal quantities, and we put acetic acid (vinegar) in our food. In the quantities we’re discussing it’s safe to use around kids and pets, it keeps bugs at bay and will keep mold from growing. It is a completely natural pesticide/fungicide.
Jeff is that like what the Tobacco Co. where telling us ?

As I read this from the medical society's side, it tells a different story.

Anyway I'm still in the camp of, there is no need to use this, so wy would we.

Boric Acid poison.jpg
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
716
Likes
520
Location
Lummi Island, WA
Sorry Leo, but we could exchange snippets from medical groups and other scientific agencies until we're both blue in the face. The point is, darn near everything will kill you if you are exposed to enough of it. The literature also includes studies of people who work in the plants where the substance is prepared and used constantly without effect.

Perhaps there is no need for you to use it - in my case, where I live, mold is a threat to wood that gets stored before use, bugs, not so much, but once in a while. If a simple spritz with a solution that is very far below any known threshold for concern will eliminate the problem while posing no danger, I'm going to use it.

By the way, there's probably a healthy dose in the wine you're drinking...
 
Joined
Aug 14, 2009
Messages
2,079
Likes
1,180
Location
Peoria, Illinois
How did Borax laundry soap stay on the market so long and still be available today being such a hazardous substance? It naturally occurs in fruit and nuts, apples and bananas—as well as almonds and peanuts, have traces of boric acid. 20 Mule Team Borax company was founded in 1890 and you can still buy the laundry soap at Walmart. Here's a couple of pictures of what I have been cutting up for firewood from my shed. Untreated soft maple and curly ambrosia maple.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_2774.jpg
    IMG_2774.jpg
    163.8 KB · Views: 14
  • IMG_2775.jpg
    IMG_2775.jpg
    148.2 KB · Views: 14
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
716
Likes
520
Location
Lummi Island, WA
I put my recipe for a dilute solution in my post earlier - just so we're all on the same page, and to get over the fear of impending death by mold spray - you'd need to mix more than 3 gallons of the spray and drink it all down before it'll kill you.
A lethal dose of boric acid is about 5 grams per kilogram of body weight. At 70 KG, I'd need to ingest 350 grams of the stuff to kill me. By comparison, common table salt will kill me at a little more than 3 grams per kilogram of body weight - 210 grams.

Wikipedia is your friend https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boric_acid

I'm all for roughing out wet wood as quickly as possible - but when I see mold within a couple of days of roughing (I don't bag my roughed blanks), I mix up a quart of the mold version (adding the peroxide - I use diluted Baquacil 27% Peroxide available at pool supply places) and give it all a spray. As a bonus, it keeps the bugs away, too.
 
Joined
Oct 13, 2016
Messages
1,080
Likes
1,591
Location
Rainy River District Ontario Canada
Believe what you want, I still say why use it when there is no need for it.
As for mold, I have used a dry cloth and wiped it off, works for me 1thumb.gif
As soon as the moisture content goes below 20 %, mold can not live.
In the case I do get the mold (seldom) on the wood, I do as I said, wipe the wood with a dry rag and place the turning in a dry brown Paper Bag.
I can not remember cases where I had to do this more than ones, killing off mold does not help as long as the conditions are good for it to grow.
After all mold spores are all around and will start growing any place the conditions are right for it.
 
Last edited:
Joined
May 30, 2022
Messages
245
Likes
250
Location
Belchertown, MA
I agree with Richard - except that you don’t need to buy prepared pesticide, just get plain boric acid, mix a cup in a gallon of warm water and mix. If mold is a problem, substitute a quart of 10% peroxide for a quart of the water (1qt 10% peroxide and 3 qt water with the cup of boric acid powder). Here in the damp Pacific Northwest, mold can be a problem with drying green woods, as are bugs at times. This solution takes care of both issues extremely well. It is very low toxicity and safe to use around pets and kids in these low dilutions - probably safer than chlorine bleach and it actually kills both molds and bugs.
I’ve used this for decades - it works and is really cheap to keep a spray bottle around. I spritz my dry blanks now and again just to keep them bug and mold free.
If you’re treating for mold by including peroxide in the mix, the solution will only be full strength for about 4 hours, so mix it fresh for mold issues. The solution still works for bugs though, so still useful.

Can I just use 20 mule team, or do I need to find something labeled “boric acid”
 
Joined
Aug 6, 2009
Messages
716
Likes
520
Location
Lummi Island, WA
Can I just use 20 mule team, or do I need to find something labeled “boric acid”
You want Boric acid, also called hydrogen borate - its often sold as roach killer, but you just need 100% boric acid without any kind of lure or bait mixed in, although I’ve used both and it doesn’t seem to make much difference. The amount of ‘bait is often less than 1%. Borax - 20 mule team and others - is typically sodium borate - the salt form. I have not used it for mold mitigation so can’t speak to its effectiveness.
 
Back
Top