CBN Wheels

[Thom Schuck]

Hello fellow Genius’s,
I am now ready to buy my first CBN grinding wheel. I know I can count on all of you to tell me what grit and make I should buy. Flat edge or round edge? I remember one that I think was Woodturners Wonders? But like everything these days I cant remember. I also would like to know what you good people think or know about Simon Hope Negative Rake Scrapers?. They look most excellent to me but I am still in the novice category. I have Doug Thompson, Cindy Drodza and plenty of Robert Sorby. I talked with one of Simons mates and I have a pal in England that can pick them up for me at the shop just down the lane from where is is staying. Might you be able to help me out here? Oh… I did buy three Hunter Carbide tools. WILD! They are just to much fun. If you remeber I got run over in my wheelchair by a drunk driver a month or so back. My doctors now say I can do light shop work. Tomorrow I turn!
Thank You Much for your help.
Thom Schuck
Portland, Oregon

 

[Darryn Achall]

If you do a search on this site for "CBN" you will find a lot of information and opinions. I feel that the best sharpening system depends on what type of tools and grinds you tend to use most. It also depends on your budget. D-Way tools displayed some amazing new CBN wheels at the Portland Symposium recently. You might check out their website. If you have done a little research and can tell the forum what wheels you are considering and why you feel they would work for you, there will be a lot of posters chiming in with their experiences and whether or not they think the proposed setup might work for you.

 

[Alan Weinberg]

check out their website

Nothing under CBN wheels except close out on 6 inch wheel . . .

 

[Darryn Achall]

Nothing under CBN wheels except close out on 6 inch wheel . . .

Premier series CBN Wheel

 

[Bill Alston]

I’m not using CBN yet but from what I’ve read 180g seems to be a popular choice. Possibly a bit fine for reshaping but a good compromise. I have read a few people are using 350g though which sounds quite fine but should leave a better finish straight from the tool? I’d be very interested to know what grits folks use when they have two CBN wheels mounted on their grinders.

Edit: This article may be of interest?

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/WoodworkTechniques/UltimateGrindingSharpeningSetUp.html

 

[Brian Gustin]

I’d be very interested to know what grits folks use when they have two CBN wheels mounted on their grinders.

Had coarse (35 grit? beats me) Al Ox on left and 180 CBN on right for a while, but after new lathe, I'm working on rearranging shop and moved grinder to a new roll-around cabinet station I built, and got a new 350 CBN , so now I have 350 on the right and 180 on the left. Using the 180 grit I could still see "sawtooth" edges - sharp, yes, but not as keen.. since adding the 350 and grinder next to lathe, I find I sharpen more, and I am happy with the results I have been getting. The 180 does quite nicely for the odd bit of reshaping I may do every so often (sure, it does take some patience on my part!), so I don't see a need for a coarser grit.

 

[Bill Alston]

Thanks for that Brian. 😉

 

[Dave Landers]

I’d be very interested to know what grits folks use when they have two CBN wheels mounted on their grinders.

I have 2 grinders dedicated to sharpening. 4 wheels means that mostly I don't have to reset platforms. The wheels are:

• 220 grit with modified wolverine arm (holes at appropriate distances for bowl and spindle gouges, so I don't have to reset the arm)
• 180 grit with a 40º platform I use for negative rake scrapers and spindle roughing gouge
• 180 grit with radius corners and a flat side (woodturners wonders "4-in-1") - platform usually at 60º for bottom-bowl gouge (sometimes has a 22º platform for skews). Also use the corners free-hand for HSS hollowing tool tips
• 80 grit with square corners and flat side (woodturners wonders "mega square") - platform at 75º for scrapers and hollowing teardrops. Also use this for some shaping or to re-establish secondary bevels etc.

I like the bur I get on traditional scrapers from the 80g, and like the finer bur from the 180g for NRS.

I don't see a big difference in the 220g vs 180g, but as I have a 220 it makes most sense that it's used for gouges vs other things.

The 220 grit wheel is on the left side of that grinder, because I stand to the side to swing the gouge in the jig, and its more comfortable for me to stand on the left, with my right hand on the gouge handle.

Major tool shaping happens on the disk sander, as I don't currently have a grinder setup with "stone" wheels.

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To @Thom Schuck 's original question:

My recommendation is 180 grit for a good general-purpose wheel.
If you sharpen HSS hollowing tips, the round edge is good (otherwise not too useful and makes the useable face of the wheel narrower).
If you sharpen things that need a flat grind (vs hollow-ground) having grit on a flat side is good.
So for one wheel I'd get a 180 with flat side - round corners for hollowing tips square otherwise.
I haven't looked recently, but when I bought mine Woodturners Wonders had good wheels at a fair price.

 

[Bill Alston]

Thanks for the input Dave, very helpful.

 

[Brian Brightwell]

I use a 2x72 belt grinder like the knife people use. It is a very useful and versatile tool. Belts come in many different grits and you can change them out it seconds. The platen plate provides a flat grind. Rubber contact wheel give a concave grind with different size wheels give different radiuses. My grinder has a 3 phase, 2 HP motor with a VFD for variable speed.

 

[Bill Alston]

Nice Belt Grinder Brian. 😉

 

[Kent Reisdorph]

I use 80 and 360 grit CBNs. I got that as a recommendation somewhere.

 

[Bill Alston]

Kent, is the 80g just for reshaping tools or do you use them straight off the grinder? I’m guessing the 360g gives a nice fine edge?

 

[Tim Pollock]

I have the 180 & 350 from woodturners wonders. If I had another grinder I'd add the 80 as the 180 can be a bit slow if much reshaping has to be done.

 

[Darryn Achall]

I have the 180 & 350 from woodturners wonders. If I had another grinder I'd add the 80 as the 180 can be a bit slow if much reshaping has to be done.

Yep, I have a 180 and 600 grit. If reshaping is needed, I take the tool to work and grind on the rough grit wheels there.

 

[Kent Reisdorph]

Kent, is the 80g just for reshaping tools or do you use them straight off the grinder? I’m guessing the 360g gives a nice fine edge?

I use the 80 for reshaping, but I'll also use it to sharpen scrapers. That's because I'm lazy and don't want to move the grinding platform to the finer wheel. As for the 360, I think the only real advantage over a 180 is it removes less material. In theory, my gouges will last longer. There's a thread from about a year ago with good info regarding the different grit wheels and their performance on tools.

 

[Adrian Wilson]

I use a 2x72 belt grinder like the knife people use. It is a very useful and versatile tool. Belts come in many different grits and you can change them out it seconds. The platen plate provides a flat grind. Rubber contact wheel give a concave grind with different size wheels give different radiuses. My grinder has a 3 phase, 2 HP motor with a VFD for variable speed. View attachment 64371

I have a couple of flatbelt grinder/sanders, my main one is 1", but I plan to upsize to one like yours. I have regular grinders too, but belt grinders are excellent tools, and underutilized I think.

 

[robo hippy]

I have mostly D Way wheels, in part because I consider both Dave Schweitzer and Jimmy Allen to be friends. They were one of the first to have them. I think I have one from Woodturnerswonders too. I don't think there is much of a quality difference if any. For wheels, if you get one, get the 180 since it will do 90% of your sharpening. For a second wheel, I would say get the 600. It does provide a finer edge which helps with punky wood. Do get the 1 1/2 inch wide wheels rather than the 1 inch wheels. Mostly because I have never put a divot in my gouge wings with the wider wheels, but it was fairly common when I had the 1 inch wide wheels. Get the straight wheels. The radius edges are good for sharpening the small hollowing bits, but not as good for straight edges like skews or most of your gouges. I do prefer the 1 hp Rikon or Baldor grinders. The 1/2 hp grinders just don't have enough muscle for me. Pretty much everybody has CBN wheels for sale now.

robo hippy

 

[JeffSmith]

My grinder (no name slow-speed Woodcraft) has had the same two wheels - 80 and 180 grit D-Way wheels - since 2011. I recently replaced the 180. It’s used primarily for gouges, the 80 is used for reshaping and scrapers mostly.
One thing to keep in mind, particularly if you’re new to cbn, is that the new wheels remove steel at a rate that can be surprising. This initial ‘vigor’ slows as they are used and broken in. The other amazing thing is that, with a little care, how long they last. I was reminded of that when replacing the 180. Seems that the older 80 with a few miles on it cuts about the same as the new 180; I’d guess the old 180 was cutting about the same as a newer 220 or maybe 360. It’s going on another grinder.
Granted, I’m not a production turner, but as a retiree I do spend a fair amount of time at the lathe, and sharpen often. The other thing to keep in mind when looking at the cost of two new wheels comparing cbn to matrix wheels - when you are fully used to sharpening on cbn, you’re removing far less steel to refresh an edge - your tools also last an amazingly long time.
Overall, the investment pays off

 

[Adrian Wilson]

I have mostly D Way wheels, in part because I consider both Dave Schweitzer and Jimmy Allen to be friends. They were one of the first to have them. I think I have one from Woodturnerswonders too. I don't think there is much of a quality difference if any. For wheels, if you get one, get the 180 since it will do 90% of your sharpening. For a second wheel, I would say get the 600. It does provide a finer edge which helps with punky wood. Do get the 1 1/2 inch wide wheels rather than the 1 inch wheels. Mostly because I have never put a divot in my gouge wings with the wider wheels, but it was fairly common when I had the 1 inch wide wheels. Get the straight wheels. The radius edges are good for sharpening the small hollowing bits, but not as good for straight edges like skews or most of your gouges. I do prefer the 1 hp Rikon or Baldor grinders. The 1/2 hp grinders just don't have enough muscle for me. Pretty much everybody has CBN wheels for sale now.

robo hippy

Have a look at the description for the new D-Way wheels that are linked above by Darryn Achall, their premium wheels..... they suggest getting 120 and 220 now, instead of 80 and 180. New developments, new rules. They sure SOUND great. Here is the link again. https://d-waytools.com/premier-series-heavy-weight-cbn-wheel-8-x-1-1-2-with-5-8-arbor-hole/

 

[Bill Blasic]

The first CBN wheels I had ever seen were at one of the AAW Symposiums many years ago and were sold by a gentleman and his daughter from I believe Austria. I bought my 180 grit from them and that wheel is still today in the exact same shape it was the day I received it. I think Cindy Drozda sold these wheels after that. I use a white wheel for reshaping tools. The only steel my 180 grit CBN have seen are 10V and 15V Thompson Tools steel.

 

[Dave Hulett]

Woodturners Wonders 180g works great for me. That's all I need

 

[Randy Heinemann]

I would agree that 180 is good if you only have 1 CBN. As for the surface shape . . . There are advantages to square an rounded edges. The square edged wheels do allow side grinding to flatten (at least some do). However, that may not be as useful if you are only grinding turning tools. It is more useful if you sharpen both turning and general woodworking tools like plane blades and chisels. The rounded edges can be real useful when grinding some hollowing tools and other tools that have rounded edges (round scrapers maybe?) I have one of each. The square edge wheel is 80 grit and the round edge is 180. I do wish the square edge was a little finer; like 120.

The one thing I really like about mine are that they are 1 1/2" wide. This width is much more useful for some tools because of the extra surface area across the wheel.

By the way, I bought mine from Wood Turners Wonders. Good price. Good selection. They have worked well. I'm sure there are other vendors out there too. A little price shopping is alwasy worth it as long as the vendors are comparable in terms of customer service.

 

[Alan Weinberg]

Have a look at the description for the new D-Way wheels that are linked above by Darryn Achall, their premium wheels..... they suggest getting 120 and 220 now, instead of 80 and 180. New developments, new rules. They sure SOUND great. Here is the link again. https://d-waytools.com/premier-series-heavy-weight-cbn-wheel-8-x-1-1-2-with-5-8-arbor-hole/

I read all the threads and waited over a year. I just (finally) pulled the trigger for the recommended 220 grit by D-Way listed above. Expensive but I think I’ll be happy. $250.