Owners poll- 18" X 47" lathes

[Roger Chandler]

William, glad you chimed in!

I echo Fred and Roger's report .
I just came in from a full afternoon of turning. . I have a LOT of hours on my Craftex CT128 . I couldn't wish for a better lathe. The only thing I would like to have had on them would be an hour counter. Mine would be quite high mileage by now.

Hate to see someone having trouble with one of those lathes but then there are Cadilacs that spend way too much time in the garage instead of on the road.
Too bad but there will always be a lemon in anything made in this fast paced age of mass production.

Hello again William,

Thanks for posting about your success with the Craftex 128! It seems to me that if yourself, Fred, and me, and many others who have posted, even Laguna owners like Earl Timmons and Tom Hamilton speak so well of their units, that we can surmise that the unit Kevin got must be a lemon, and not indicative of this line of lathes in general.

I think that Laguna should go the extra mile for Kevin, and try to get him a unit swapped out for his defective one, and should go over it very well before they even ship it to him, to verify the centers line up, etc.

Most research I did before deciding to purchase was with owners who gave this lathe good reviews.

 

[kevinkabby]

roger

My question is how reliable are the reviews. I personally, am a professional turner. I do it every day. How many reviews have you that the person used the lathe more than 4 hours a week?

It is also a proven fact that jet uses better electronics than that is used on these lathes.

If I have a dud, how come that: 1 centers dont line up (thats a dud)
2. Motor heats up
3. Switch goes out at about 4 months
4. customer service sucks
5. customer service sucks
6.they have a 5 month back order
7. forgot that the tool rest broke when it fell off of the lathe beds...great casting(was a air pocket)
8. I have to use a wrench to tighten the banjo and the tailstock

What that tells me is that this company that they are purchasing these products is using lesser grade materials from the electonics, to the castings. The precision is not there at all. Besides who makes a lathe without a hand wheel in the first place. When they said it was designed by woodturners for woodturners...who were they. Cause the guy on the video that laguna has was using a spindle gouge attempting to hollow out a bowl. Funny thing I have been dealing with laguna all week and I talked to a guy finally today who might be able to help me (basically blew smoke up my a!@). He told me that when they order say 50...sometimes when the container comes it has 30. So if they cant count to 50, that should tell you something.

My guess is that every reviews that I read and you read was from weekend warriors that dreams all week to be turning on his lathe. When you work on one every day you know what you need and want in order to perform properly.

I have learned to believe about 10 percent of what you read on a website unless you know they are a pro.

 

[Fred Lockwood]

Kevin, I can understand that you are somewhat p****d off, I would be too in your position.

Could I make a couple of points, not to defend Laguna, don't know them from a bar of soap and if I was treated by a company like you have obviously been I would feel like you too. Nor do I want to defend this lathe, as Bill said, with mass production you can finish up with a lemon and even Cadillacs (especially?) can spend a lot of time in the garage. On that subject one of our national newspapers recently published an owners poll on reliability of cars, Mercedes and BMW came in 28 and 29th position

I am not a "weekend warrior" as you so disparagingly call people that don't turn for a living, I am retired and use my lathe almost every day for several hours, but obviously I don't use it like a professional like you would.

If I was a professional turner however, I would not buy a cheap Chinese lathe like this one. I would be professional about it and spend a professional amount of money and buy something like a Vicmarc VL300, a Oneway or a Powermatic.

I wouldn't even buy a Jet, most Jet equipment is of the same standard as the lathe you have purchased, just with a clever white paint job and squillions spent on advertising to build a brand. Read any pen forum and find out how many Jet Mini Lathes have had broken switches, not once but several times, together with other electrical problems. A local turner even had to have his spindle re-machined as it was seriously out of round.

Trying to penny pinch buying tools on which your income depends will always end in tears, as you have found out.

For the money this lathe is a seriously good buy, but in the real world you don't buy a Rolls Royce for a Hyundai price.

 

[Roger Chandler]

professional vs. hobbyist

My question is how reliable are the reviews. I personally, am a professional turner. I do it every day. How many reviews have you that the person used the lathe more than 4 hours a week?

It is also a proven fact that jet uses better electronics than that is used on these lathes.

If I have a dud, how come that: 1 centers dont line up (thats a dud)
2. Motor heats up
3. Switch goes out at about 4 months
4. customer service sucks
5. customer service sucks
6.they have a 5 month back order
7. forgot that the tool rest broke when it fell off of the lathe beds...great casting(was a air pocket)
8. I have to use a wrench to tighten the banjo and the tailstock

What that tells me is that this company that they are purchasing these products is using lesser grade materials from the electonics, to the castings. The precision is not there at all. Besides who makes a lathe without a hand wheel in the first place. When they said it was designed by woodturners for woodturners...who were they. Cause the guy on the video that laguna has was using a spindle gouge attempting to hollow out a bowl. Funny thing I have been dealing with laguna all week and I talked to a guy finally today who might be able to help me (basically blew smoke up my a!@). He told me that when they order say 50...sometimes when the container comes it has 30. So if they cant count to 50, that should tell you something.

My guess is that every reviews that I read and you read was from weekend warriors that dreams all week to be turning on his lathe. When you work on one every day you know what you need and want in order to perform properly.

I have learned to believe about 10 percent of what you read on a website unless you know they are a pro.

Kevin,

Since you do make a living at turning, I am sure your requirements and usage are indeed more than a hobbyist like myself. Reviews we all know are subjective things that reflect the perceptions of the one who has used the product.

It may be that in order to get what you are looking for in a lathe, that one of the "high end" models may be the only ones that will give you what you are looking for. I have seen the Jet 16/42 up close, and have turned on a PM3520b, and in the experience I had, the Grizzly gave me very similar performance to the 3520b.
Whether that would stand up in the long term with heavy daily use, I do not know, but so far I feel like I got a great value on a unit that has done everything I wanted it to do with impressive results.

I do think you probably got a lemon, but I am not in any way arguing anything or any point with you. It bothers me [especially for someone who makes his living] for the investment you have made not to pan out, and I think the manufacturer could have caught the problems you have with your unit if they were strict on QC standards.

others who have posted speak of heavy usage, and satisfaction with their unit, so I don't have a clue where the breakdown occurred with your unit.

Maybe it is like the car manufactures used to be.... they said don't buy a car made on a Monday morning because the weekend was full of drinking and such and a lot of workers had hangovers, and don't buy one made on Friday afternoon, because the workers take shortcuts because they want to leave for the weekend, and try to hurry up and get out of the plant.

I don't know if that has any merit, but I had a guy who worked in a Ford plant tell me that many years ago. Our problem is that we have no idea when anything was made or under what circumstances, and we rely upon the companies reps. to oversee the product and make sure it is right for the customer when it ships. Somewhere, that must not have happened for your unit.

I really do hope Laguna gets this resolved for you quickly, and everything works out. I am by choice an optimist, but I can tell you, I would have many of the same feelings you have if I had your experience. I just don't want to paint a picture of my own experiences that is inaccurate. What I have experienced with my Grizzly lathe has been very good so far, and if for some reason that changes, I will speak up about that as well.

Good luck Kevin, I really wish you the best as you go forward...Blessings to you!

 

[Roger Chandler]

wear & tear on equipment

Just some thoughts related to wear & tear on equipment. I am one of those people who really take care of my equipment. Religious about changing oil in my vehicles and use a high quality one at that. I don't dog my equipment, and drive like I have seen a lot of people do, and for the most part I get great service and longevity out of my vehicles and my woodworking tools.

A professional or a rank amateur in wood turning can go either way with caring for their equipment. For example, I am careful about allowing the handles on my lathe to seat correctly before applying pressure to lock up the tool rest, and I keep all the screws in proper adjustment, and that is probably why I have not had any issues with the stripping out, although I did hear that Grizzly had the sockets deepened on their handles to make the seat better.

Because I want my saws, my drills, my nailers, whatever, to function well, I pay attention to using them, and maintaining them correctly. I don't baby them, but do care for them, and that has served me well for years.

All that being said, equipment we purchase should be made to quality standards, and should be expected by manufacturer and purchaser to serve them well for the long term. Attention to detail and quality that makes the customer's experience with the product satisfactory is the manufactures no. 1 priority,and should be kept in mind at all phases of the manufacturing process and Quality control should verify it on every single unit!

 

[Tom Hamilton]

Laguna 18/47 Owner

Hello All,

Good to see this thread is still alive.

I am not a professional woodturner, although I turn 3 to 4 hours a day on my Laguna.

I was turning an 18" Black Walnut bowl yesterday, and after I got done coring out my first core my lathe had a "knock". I was sure I had a bad spindle bearing.

I tried things like putting a new drive belt on it, still knocked. I found that if I lifted the motor, that the motor was quite as ever, so it had to be something spindle related.

I called Laguna service. They took my call right away, said they'd get the repair department on the line right away and put me on hold. About 10 seconds later Torben Helshoj (Laguna founder) answered my service call.

He and I went so far as for me to go down from my office to the shop and he listened to the lathe knock over the phone. He knew right away that it was not the spindle bearing. We worked through all the troubleshooting on the phone, Torben was very helpfull. What I found was that there are two set screws on the spindle pully (driven pully), the one over the keyway was tight, but the other set screw was loose. That was the problem. Torben was very happy we found it, but I was even happier with the simple fix.

This is the third time I've dealt with Laguna on a warrentee issue. Each time has actually gotten better.

I wish all Laguna customers where as lucky as me, and satisfied.

Good luck to all and keep the shavings flying.

Tom

 

[Roger Chandler]

Thanks for the post Tom

Hello All,

Good to see this thread is still alive.

I am not a professional woodturner, although I turn 3 to 4 hours a day on my Laguna.

I was turning an 18" Black Walnut bowl yesterday, and after I got done coring out my first core my lathe had a "knock". I was sure I had a bad spindle bearing.

I tried things like putting a new drive belt on it, still knocked. I found that if I lifted the motor, that the motor was quite as ever, so it had to be something spindle related.

I called Laguna service. They took my call right away, said they'd get the repair department on the line right away and put me on hold. About 10 seconds later Torben Helshoj (Laguna founder) answered my service call.

He and I went so far as for me to go down from my office to the shop and he listened to the lathe knock over the phone. He knew right away that it was not the spindle bearing. We worked through all the troubleshooting on the phone, Torben was very helpfull. What I found was that there are two set screws on the spindle pully (driven pully), the one over the keyway was tight, but the other set screw was loose. That was the problem. Torben was very happy we found it, but I was even happier with the simple fix.

This is the third time I've dealt with Laguna on a warrentee issue. Each time has actually gotten better.

I wish all Laguna customers where as lucky as me, and satisfied.

Good luck to all and keep the shavings flying.

Tom

Hi again Tom,

It is good to hear from you, and the fact that you had a service need, and it was met with prompt, knowlegable service, from the company owner, no less.

This lineup of lathes is giving the great majority of its owners great performance and service. I rough turned a cherry log this evening, so that I can complete it in the next day or so [we have our local club meeting on Saturday morning] and this Grizzly G0698 just knocks it out of the park. The unit is quiet, smooth and has power to spare.

I rough turned on the high belt setting, and even though the blank was out of round a bit, and was heavier on one end than the other, I just put it between centers and proceeded to turn a tenon on the end and then put it into my SN2 chuck, and away she went smooth as silk.

I wanted to say thank you for the tip on the belts, and I ordered 3 like you did from Belts4less.com, and they were very reasonable and were a perfect fit. I now have plenty of spares should I ever need them.

I am looking forward to getting the vacuum chuck from JT turning tools, and will do that before long.

I sure had the shaving a-flyin' this evening...... like ribbons and fine curlies

 

[Steve Kubien]

To add a little something about the Busy Bee model

Hey folks,

I just found out through another forum that Busy Bee/Craftex is changing the spindle on their CT128 to 1-1/4"x8tpi from the current 1"x8tpi. The new product number for the lathe will be CT128N. I have no idea if they are keeping the 1" version or when the change/addition will take place.

Just passing it along.
Steve

 

[Roger Chandler]

Good information Steve

Hey folks,

I just found out through another forum that Busy Bee/Craftex is changing the spindle on their CT128 to 1-1/4"x8tpi from the current 1"x8tpi. The new product number for the lathe will be CT128N. I have no idea if they are keeping the 1" version or when the change/addition will take place.

Just passing it along.
Steve

Hi Steve,

An interesting bit of information. It looks like Busy Bee might be getting more uniformity with the other models in this lineup. It could be a number of inquiries have spoken to the wish for the larger spindle size.

Are you an owner? If so, how has your unit performed?

 

[William Young]

That is true. Busybee will be offering it with both 1" and 1 1/4" spindles .
It was discussed on the turning board in my own WWF site as well .

Here was the first person that mentioned it and my reply to him is below it. .

I read this on another site that Busy Bee is introducing a new lathe called the CT 128N. It is the same as the old CT128 except the spindle size is 1 1/4 instead of the 1. Price is about the same. They do not have a picture of it yet on their site or anything about it, but a description of it was given by Busy Bee on the site that I read about this.

Cheers Al

That's interesting AL .
I just checked BusyBee's site and they are showing the new one but don't show any specs on it yet.
They also do not have a discount price on it yet and is actually priced higher than the regular price on the CT128.

http://busybeetools.ca/cgi-bin/product10?&NMCLASS=00165&NSBCLASS=00274&NETID=1437500624103229957

If it does have a 1 1/4" spindle it will be nice for ones that have all 1 1/4" accessories.
I was glad to get one with the 1" spindle to match all of mine without buying the adapters.
Once we see the specs we will know if it is identical apart from spindle size or not.

I would think the only difference required for the bigger spindle diameter would be the inside diameter of the bearings used and pressed into the same casting. Which means that anyone with the 1" could change it up to 1 1/4" by buying the spindle and bearings to match.

Just guessing and doing a little mind wandering. :



And then another member answered and said he heard right from BusyBee that it will be the same lathe except for spindle size and they would have the picture up soon.

 

[Steve Kubien]

Are you an owner? If so, how has your unit performed?

No Roger, I turn on a Nova 1624. I just knew there was a lot of interest in this thread and lathes this size so I thought I would throw it out there. One very serious (to me) thing that would steer me away from the Busy Bee is the 2" travel on the tailstock quill. As a making of peppermills, that would kill me!

 

[Roger Chandler]

The specs on the quill travel are wrong

No Roger, I turn on a Nova 1624. I just knew there was a lot of interest in this thread and lathes this size so I thought I would throw it out there. One very serious (to me) thing that would steer me away from the Busy Bee is the 2" travel on the tailstock quill. As a making of peppermills, that would kill me!

Steve,

Somewhere there was posted or advertised some specs that were wrong. The actual quill travel in the tailstock is 4-3/8 inches, and it does a good job of getting deep. The quill is also self-ejecting.

For the larger sizes of peppermills, a bit extender needs to be used with most all lathes.

Thanks for your post. It helps to hear about the perceptions that have developed, some accurate and some not, and we can get the real information to those who are interested in this line-up.

 

[William Young]

For sure that is a typo in their specs. Mine is from BusyBee and it does indeed have a graduated 4 3/8" quill travel. I was sure pleased to see that when it arrived because I was expecting 2" like I had been used to on my previous lathe.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Confirmation

For sure that is a typo in their specs. Mine is from BusyBee and it does indeed have a graduated 4 3/8" quill travel. I was sure pleased to see that when it arrived because I was expecting 2" like I had been used to on my previous lathe.

William,

Thanks for posting an owner's confirmation of the actual quill travel specs! I was pretty certain that the specs were the same across the line, as far as the quill travel was concerned.

 

[Steve Kubien]

That's good to hear William. Thanks!

 

[Roger Chandler]

known quantity vs. Unknown

While it is human nature to go with what is familiar, in the case of machines on the market[lathes] there have been some that have developed a good reputation, and have a track record that has been developed by actual usage by turners everywhere. That being acknowledged and also valued by most all of us, I want to take a look back:

There was a time when the PM3520b was new, and untested, as well as the Jet 1642, and other lathes when they came on the market. All capitalized on the growing interest in wood turning in general and marketed in ads and trade shows, and other venues, which built them a following, as we see exists today.

My point is that the Grizzly G0698 and Laguna 18x47 and other iterations in this line up are now coming along, and if new owners who are coming along begin to experience the performance of this line up, then this line up will begin to gain in reputation as well over time.

I think the Grizzly G0698 that I own will hold its own with the Jet 1642 any day of the week, and has more capacity. It is not as heavy as the PM3520b, but performs like one in smoothness and features, notwithstanding it doesn't have the extra centers [comparator] hand wheel, or cage.

Looking at the posts of the owners shows this lineup of lathes has brought a new niche into the market.... a full featured lathe at a price that most turners can get their pocketbooks around. I believe that is why the other brands are running sales, and giving back on the premium prices they were getting for a while. They see the handwriting on the wall.

One thing I know from personal experience..... this line up of 18x47 lathes have great features and perform on par with lathes costing twice or more. [not withstanding one negative experience, which other makes have been known to have as well]

 

[William Young]

Well said Roger .
I can certainly relate to that and have heard of the problems that some of the very expensive lathes have encountered.
There will always be a lemon somewhere along the line with any make , model , or color at any price.
Over the years I have dealt with BusyBee quite a few times and their service and warranty have always been top notch.
What more could a person want . Great lathe, great price and great service.

One thing I know from personal experience..... this line up of 18x47 lathes have great features and perform on par with lathes costing twice or more. [not withstanding one negative experience, which other makes have been known to have as well]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT
At the same time as I was typing my message this came in.
http://editor.ne16.com/htmleditor/v...b4190de032054218a4c&MailID=12818912&text=true.
Yes, they are feeling the competitive pinch .

 

[Roger Chandler]

Those who hven't turned on an 18x47 don't know

Well said Roger .
I can certainly relate to that and have heard of the problems that some of the very expensive lathes have encountered.
There will always be a lemon somewhere along the line with any make , model , or color at any price.
Over the years I have dealt with BusyBee quite a few times and their service and warranty have always been top notch.
What more could a person want . Great lathe, great price and great service.





EDIT
At the same time as I was typing my message this came in.
http://editor.ne16.com/htmleditor/v...b4190de032054218a4c&MailID=12818912&text=true.
Yes, they are feeling the competitive pinch .

Hi again William,

I have turned on several lathes including a PM3520b, and boy it was indeed a nice experience, and it is a great lathe. Many who have been leery of taking the plunge on an 18x47 model have been skeptical because of a lack of track record. That bothered me also, and made me bore down and really make apples to apples comparison in my research, and I searched for every review that I could find, talked with company reps, and other folks who had dealings with the service of the companies.

I decided to go with Grizzly because I believed they would stand behind their product if I ever needed parts or service, and I knew this lathe was made with their specs, most similar to the other 18x47's, but also with their own quality control.

What those who have not turned on this line don't know is that the performance is definitely there with this unit, and it fills the need for a full featured lathe at an affordable [for most] price. Most everyone knows of the Jet & PM performance and that is why they are desired by a lot of folks seeking to upgrade their lathes, but they don't know that the 18x47 lineup matches up in performance and features, only at a more affordable price, and maybe with a few less bells and whistles, and it has more capacity in swing and between centers. It was [IMHO] a great buy for a great lathe.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Lost a bowl, broke apart

I had a cherry bowl come apart on me the other evening. On another forum some of the posters were saying my going back to the rim was probably the culprit [bad technique] and also the blank most likely had stress fractures in the layers [wind shake?]

What I posted for was to say that once again, the Grizzly G0698 just performed so well that I am impressed by its performance all over again. Smooth, quiet and the variable speed makes it so enjoyable for each step in roughing out, to turning high speed, then going slow again for sanding. The reverse feature is really nice as well.

Even though I lost the bowl, the lathe was flawless in its performance. Its been too hot to turn for the last couple of days, but I look forward to getting back to spinnin' wood in the next few days.

 

[kevinkabby]

laguna 18/47

Whether or not the lathe is a performer. Laguna's customer service isn't performing well. It has been a month now and still am waiting for a switch. What I am sure is happening, instead of them attempting to make me happy, they are trying to sweep me under the rug.

From what I have read and talked to people personally about laguna is that if your in, your in. If your not you will get the worst service possible.

I was interested in getting a bandsaw from them, but after dealing with this crap, I will not purchase anything from them no matter how quality of a tool it is for the simple fact is that their service is horrible.

Funny, on the banjo and the tailstock the handles stripped with in a month. I waited for a month for the part, and it never shipped. called them, they said they didn't have record of it being a problem. LOL. Now, with the switch going, i told them that I wanted new handles. After all of the bull I have had to deal with, the service rep told me that I needed to take pictures in order for him to send new parts. LOL Basically a 5 dollar part of white metal.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Sorry to hear....

Whether or not the lathe is a performer. Laguna's customer service isn't performing well. It has been a month now and still am waiting for a switch. What I am sure is happening, instead of them attempting to make me happy, they are trying to sweep me under the rug.

From what I have read and talked to people personally about laguna is that if your in, your in. If your not you will get the worst service possible.

I was interested in getting a bandsaw from them, but after dealing with this crap, I will not purchase anything from them no matter how quality of a tool it is for the simple fact is that their service is horrible.

Funny, on the banjo and the tailstock the handles stripped with in a month. I waited for a month for the part, and it never shipped. called them, they said they didn't have record of it being a problem. LOL. Now, with the switch going, i told them that I wanted new handles. After all of the bull I have had to deal with, the service rep told me that I needed to take pictures in order for him to send new parts. LOL Basically a 5 dollar part of white metal.

Hi Kevin,

Gee whiz, it sure seems like Laguna would take your case as an opportunity to get the issues fixed, if they value their reputation of customer service.

You mentioned "white" metal on the handles.... if it is the same as some call "pop" metal, then I can understand your frustration. Mine look to be solid steel, and if I keep the screw adjusted correctly, I don't have any issues with stripping out. I know they feel solid, and have no creep in them when adjusted correctly. I heard [but have no way of personally verifying this, that Grizzly had the handles changed, and deepened the sockets for better lock up].

I hope they get the switch to you soon, as what you had to do [hotwire; bypass the switch ?] your lathe should not be the case, IMHO. At least you had a competent electrician to do it, so it should be safe until you do get the switch. I suppose you just plug and unplug the unit from the power source.

My thinking is that if I owned the company, and I had a customer who had the issues you have had, then I would go the "extra mile" or even the extra 10 miles to try and get the issues solved. I may be a dinosaur [extinct] but I still believe that a good product backed by good service is the best way to do business, especially if you want to keep loyal customers, or have a line-up of products that they might need in the future [such as a bandsaw].

Grizzly's order of new units has been pushed back to August, so I am thinking that there has been a delay in getting the units and parts from the factory in China.......I don't know if that is the case, but both companies seem to have a delay for some reason.

Keep us posted on how things are going..... we want to see these things resolved to your satisfaction.

Thanks for posting Kevin

 

[kevinkabby]

customer dis-service

Laguna was supposed to ship:

1. Switch for lathe

2. handles for banjo and tailstock

3. variable speed knob that stripped out


The contents I recieved:

1. Reset button

2. Some other reset button

3. Variable speed knob

I called customer service today for about the 10th time in the last month. Every time it is a new story. So the customer service guy "ron" said after I had described "What a switch looks like" says..." I am looking at one right now" I proceed to ask him if he could package it himself and ship it today for overnight shipping. He said that he couldn't ship overnight. I would have to pay for it. WTF!!!! So then I asked him about the handles. Gee...I don't know, are you sure you ordered them. WTF!!! again. I proceeded to loose my cool.

How can a company like this stay in business? I don't care how shitty the product, if you stand behind it and give good service that is the most important. Can't wait to get my new one. LOL. Hopefully it will be made on a wednesday.

I recently purchased a 24 inch porter cable dovetail jig for making box urns. The router bases weren't able to be centered on the guides. The jig fingers weren't milled accurately and also the stabilizer bar didn't line up with the fingers.

I called and talked to the rep. I had the jig the next day, new router bases the next day, and was delivered right to my shops loading dock by the rep. Not only did I recieve exceptional service, they gave me almost 200 dollars in router bits(retail). Granted I spent 600 on the jig, 400 on two routers, 100 on stops and 100 on router bits to start. I spent 1200 dollars for the whole set up, and they could include 200 dollars worth of bits for my troubles.

But yet Laguna cant and won't overnight a 10 dollar part.

My advice to anyone who is planning on purchasing a 18/47, go with the grizzly. Or purchase a jet or powermatic simply for the service.

 

[Roger Chandler]

differences with customer service

Laguna was supposed to ship:

1. Switch for lathe

2. handles for banjo and tailstock

3. variable speed knob that stripped out


The contents I recieved:

1. Reset button

2. Some other reset button

3. Variable speed knob

I called customer service today for about the 10th time in the last month. Every time it is a new story. So the customer service guy "ron" said after I had described "What a switch looks like" says..." I am looking at one right now" I proceed to ask him if he could package it himself and ship it today for overnight shipping. He said that he couldn't ship overnight. I would have to pay for it. WTF!!!! So then I asked him about the handles. Gee...I don't know, are you sure you ordered them. WTF!!! again. I proceeded to loose my cool.

How can a company like this stay in business? I don't care how shitty the product, if you stand behind it and give good service that is the most important. Can't wait to get my new one. LOL. Hopefully it will be made on a wednesday.

I recently purchased a 24 inch porter cable dovetail jig for making box urns. The router bases weren't able to be centered on the guides. The jig fingers weren't milled accurately and also the stabilizer bar didn't line up with the fingers.

I called and talked to the rep. I had the jig the next day, new router bases the next day, and was delivered right to my shops loading dock by the rep. Not only did I recieve exceptional service, they gave me almost 200 dollars in router bits(retail). Granted I spent 600 on the jig, 400 on two routers, 100 on stops and 100 on router bits to start. I spent 1200 dollars for the whole set up, and they could include 200 dollars worth of bits for my troubles.

But yet Laguna cant and won't overnight a 10 dollar part.

My advice to anyone who is planning on purchasing a 18/47, go with the grizzly. Or purchase a jet or powermatic simply for the service.

Wow Keven, that is incredible! [not in good way, either] I have not had the first problem with my Grizzly G0698, and while I have a second toolrest assembly ordered [it is on back order till 8/24/10] I have had exceptional service so far from Grizzly Industrial. I want the 2nd tool rest base because I have a duplicator that I want to use, and it requires 2 banjos, so when I get the second one, it will be a go for me to use.

Just to show the difference, when I called Grizzly about getting a second toolrest base, they only had them priced out as individual parts, that would require me to assemble everything. The tech guys said they would contact the factory, and have a complete assembly made up for me, and it cost less than 1/3 what all the parts would have been purchased individually. It was the tech guys idea, and it made everything much more affordable, and it will be ready to go when it arrives [no assembly]

Big difference in customer service if you ask me.....maybe others could take a lesson, and I personally always do try to think how I sound to the company rep, as that engenders goodwill towards my particular issue.

They could have sent the correct parts, by the way!!! I can certainly understand your frustration!

 

[William Young]

My advice to anyone who is planning on purchasing a 18/47, go with the grizzly. Or purchase a jet or powermatic simply for the service.
__________________
Kevin Kabacinski
5th Density Studios
5thdensity.biz

Or BusyBee for the Craftex CT128 for ones living in Canada . BusyBee has excellent service.
I ordered a bunch of other items from BB last week . 10" high quality German made saw blade , Some 12" PSA sanding discs etc . . etc . . and while I was at it I got them to include one each of the three handles on the lathe on a no charge basis of course. Canada post sevice is terribly slow compared to US post but that parcel should be here any day now.
I will see if there is any difference in the handles compared to the earlier ones. Even if that pot metal was deeper as someone thought it might be , it would help but I would prefer the handle part to be steel rather than the white (pot) metal to match up with the steel bolt part of the handle assembly. That would make it a lifetime part.
If it looks like they have got new stock of a better made handle in by now I will report back on my findings after making a comparison .

Other than that and the lack of a outboard headstock handwheel (which was a no brainer to correct) I am totally delighted with my lathe and it has had a lot of hard use.
When I consider the well over $1000.00 I saved on mine compared to paying for more of a "brand" name it has been a great all around choice and I have no regrets at all.

What was hard to believe when I bought mine was that I ordered it before 11.00 AM one day and it was put on overnight transport and was here at noon the very next day. It is only a twelve hour drive from where it was orderd from to where I live but that was still pretty darn good service.

 

[kevinkabby]

I recieved a phone call from the customer service rep, He said he was able to get it approved for overnight shipping. One thing he forgot to ship was the handles. Are you kidding me? No a speaka englesh?

I called and said I wanted to talk to the owner. LOL. funny how that works. Judging by the response from the original message from the service rep, he must have gotten in trouble.

 

[Roger Chandler]

handles

Or BusyBee for the Craftex CT128 for ones living in Canada . BusyBee has excellent service.
I ordered a bunch of other items from BB last week . 10" high quality German made saw blade , Some 12" PSA sanding discs etc . . etc . . and while I was at it I got them to include one each of the three handles on the lathe on a no charge basis of course. Canada post sevice is terribly slow compared to US post but that parcel should be here any day now.
I will see if there is any difference in the handles compared to the earlier ones. Even if that pot metal was deeper as someone thought it might be , it would help but I would prefer the handle part to be steel rather than the white (pot) metal to match up with the steel bolt part of the handle assembly. That would make it a lifetime part.
If it looks like they have got new stock of a better made handle in by now I will report back on my findings after making a comparison .

Other than that and the lack of a outboard headstock handwheel (which was a no brainer to correct) I am totally delighted with my lathe and it has had a lot of hard use.
When I consider the well over $1000.00 I saved on mine compared to paying for more of a "brand" name it has been a great all around choice and I have no regrets at all.

What was hard to believe when I bought mine was that I ordered it before 11.00 AM one day and it was put on overnight transport and was here at noon the very next day. It is only a twelve hour drive from where it was orderd from to where I live but that was still pretty darn good service.

Hello again William,

Just wanted to say that in looking at the handles on my Grizzly G0698 they look to be solid steel to me. They look different than the handles on my old Craftsman lathe that broke on me, and they were for sure the "white" or "pot" metal that you and Kevin speak of. I have seen many items over the years out of the white metal such as bandsaw blade guides, etc, so I know what it is.

My handles look to me and feel like solid steel, and they have heft for the size where white metal is light in weight. When I keep the screw adjusted, I have no slippage at all. The one time I did have a little was when the screw had backed out and was not allowing the proper tension to be maintained in the socket. There is a spring in there that must engage so the teeth can be tensioned against the socket. Mine work just fine.

Just thought the information might be helpful to you, and if needed maybe replacements could be ordered through another vendor if you wanted to take that route.

 

[William Young]

Thanks Roger.
I will see what these look like when they arrive.
I will even weigh them to see if they are heavier made than the originals.

Just thought the information might be helpful to you, and if needed maybe replacements could be ordered through another vendor if you wanted to take that route.

Ordering through another vendor would no doubt put a price to me on them. BB does not have an on line price on theirs .
I would not hesitate to buy them from anyone if they were all steel .
Do you know of a site that has them priced out as an accessory ? They can't be worth all that much and the only part required is the handle itself. The steel bolt and spring and screw that the handle goes onto is just fine. Seems silly to have to get all the good parts in order to just get the poorly made part .

 

[Roger Chandler]

re. handles

Thanks Roger.
I will see what these look like when they arrive.
I will even weigh them to see if they are heavier made than the originals.



Ordering through another vendor would no doubt put a price to me on them. BB does not have an on line price on theirs .
I would not hesitate to buy them from anyone if they were all steel .
Do you know of a site that has them priced out as an accessory ? They can't be worth all that much and the only part required is the handle itself. The steel bolt and spring and screw that the handle goes onto is just fine. Seems silly to have to get all the good parts in order to just get the poorly made part .

William,

the only thing I have regarding info on the handles is the parts list that comes with my lathe. Here is the part number:

no.13 - P0698013 TOOL REST LOCK LEVER

I do not know if it differs any from the one listed in your Craftex 128 manual. I know my manual has pictures of different models, including the G0698 18x47, but I would think the parts list is accurate.

Another turner told me that in talking to one of the reps from Grizzly, they had changed the handles on the G0632,[[pictures are in my manual as well] and upgraded the sockets by deepening them, and that they were improved on the G0698 as well.

I hope this is accurate, but I cannot be absolute in this statement, so take it as likely, but subject to information I do not have. I would not mis-lead anyone knowingly, so I state this is likely, but I am not 100% on this. What I do know from my own personal experience is that my handles do not appear to be white metal, but solid steel, and they have not given me any problems.

 

[William Young]

William,

the only thing I have regarding info on the handles is the parts list that comes with my lathe. Here is the part number:

no.13 - P0698013 TOOL REST LOCK LEVER

I do not know if it differs any from the one listed in your Craftex 128 manual. I know my manual has pictures of different models, including the G0698 18x47, but I would think the parts list is accurate.

Another turner told me that in talking to one of the reps from Grizzly, they had changed the handles on the G0632,[[pictures are in my manual as well] and upgraded the sockets by deepening them, and that they were improved on the G0698 as well.

I hope this is accurate, but I cannot be absolute in this statement, so take it as likely, but subject to information I do not have. I would not mis-lead anyone knowingly, so I state this is likely, but I am not 100% on this. What I do know from my own personal experience is that my handles do not appear to be white metal, but solid steel, and they have not given me any problems.

Don't know how the other name sakes and suppliers of the same lathe work but here is how BusyBee has theirs set up.

The Craftex CT128 has three different part numbers . These are the numbers from the parts list .

#13 is for the tool support handle
#19 is the tailstock quill handle
#63 is the belt tighener handle below the motor.



All of them have identical handle and screw and spring but all have a different bolt/shaft .
Tool support one has a flat end to go against the tool.
Tailstock quill one has a *tit* on the end to fit in the channel in the quill.
Belt tightner has a longer threaded shaft that the other two. .

In spite of them all having the same handle part , they will only send them by part number. Which means (for instance) if you only need the tool rest one and they are out of it , they will not send you that one until they have new stock in. They will not substitute with another part number just to get the outer handle part. Seems silly that they would not order in a bunch of the outer handle parts only and supply them like that seeing as they are all identical.
Something to keep in mind when ordering under warranty. Get any one of them that they do have in stock and just use the handle part to put on your existing bolt part. They will not send two of any one part number so if they are out of one number, ask for another one and just use the removeable handle part. DAMHIKT

 

[William Young]

UPDATE .
My handles arrived . Here is a picture to point out what I previously mentioned about different configurations and length of the bolt part..

All of the handles are interchangeable with any of the bolt parts.
They obviously still have stock left of the original yellow ones . That is the one for the tool rest holder. The depth of the teeth to contact the bolt is pathetic and I don't expect it to last very long at all.. I wish they had sent a black one instead of that one.
The black ones however do have about double the length of teeth in them so they should be better.

Here is another weird little twist .To look at them one would think the black ones would be the heavier ones. They are not and they certainly are not made of steel as we were hoping for. Same type of soft metal and a little different shape and a different color.
Here are the weights as measured on a gram scale
Black = 20 grams
Yellow = 33 grams.
Go figure. I was hoping they would have been heavier and stronger. Can only hope now that the longer teeth on the inside of the black ones will make them last longer.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Info on the handles

UPDATE .
My handles arrived . Here is a picture to point out what I previously mentioned about different configurations and length of the bolt part..

All of the handles are interchangeable with any of the bolt parts.
They obviously still have stock left of the original yellow ones . That is the one for the tool rest holder. The depth of the teeth to contact the bolt is pathetic and I don't expect it to last very long at all.. I wish they had sent a black one instead of that one.
The black ones however do have about double the length of teeth in them so they should be better.

Here is another weird little twist .To look at them one would think the black ones would be the heavier ones. They are not and they certainly are not made of steel as we were hoping for. Same type of soft metal and a little different shape and a different color.
Here are the weights as measured on a gram scale
Black = 20 grams
Yellow = 33 grams.
Go figure. I was hoping they would have been heavier and stronger. Can only hope now that the longer teeth on the inside of the black ones will make them last longer.

William,

Thanks for taking the time to show pics of the handles on your Craftex 128. First of all, I don't know if the same handles are throughout the whole of the line, regardless of what label is on them [probable?]

Also you spoke of the longer teeth which would make for a better lock up. That must be the upgraded handles we were hearing about. All mine are black in color, and have not given me any problems. I find the picture of yours to show a shape similar to the ones on my Grizzly G0698, but I have no way of knowing for sure without being able to compare them side by side.

On my old lathe, before I hauled it off to the scrap metal yard, I stripped the old handles off it, because they fit the Grizzly as well [same bolt size and threads] and I have them if I ever need a replacement [I have 4 total] but I would most likely order the correct part from Grizzly, and just use one of the ones from the other lathe as a temporary fix, if it should ever be needed.

Additional: I went back and looked again at you picture of the handles, at a larger size, and did notice that my handles seem to have a longer handle shaft than the ones in your picture, and a longer socket section. The style like the yellow one is not included anywhere on the Grizzly G0698, and if that was the old style, then I could see why they changed them out to a better unit, because that does not have room for hardly any tooth length at all. The black one on the left is most similar in shape to mine, but proportionally mine look to be longer in the socket and have a bit longer handle than the ones in your picture.

 

[kevinkabby]

switch finally showed up

The switch finally showed up after almost a month of customer service. I plug the switch in exactly how it was on the old one. Yes I labeled them. I turned it on, 2 seconds later it went pop!!! The rpm read out fried. They told me that it must have been a short when I hooked up the switch.

The guy proceed to tell me to get an electrician to wire it up. LOL. I have no clue what will happen next.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Murphy?

The switch finally showed up after almost a month of customer service. I plug the switch in exactly how it was on the old one. Yes I labeled them. I turned it on, 2 seconds later it went pop!!! The rpm read out fried. They told me that it must have been a short when I hooked up the switch.

The guy proceed to tell me to get an electrician to wire it up. LOL. I have no clue what will happen next.

Hi Kevin,

Murphy's law? [if anything can go wrong, it surely will?]

I am just at a loss for words for your situation! I think that Laguna should somehow get your lathe serviced by their certified technician and put it in proper working order with all the needed adjustments and or parts to do so.

If I owned a company, I would want to see my product and service be of a high caliber, and I would want to do everything "reasonably" in my power to make the product right.

That being said, I realize that there is a warranty period, but even if the unit is out of warranty, if the reports from the customer were coming in to the service department before the warranty period was over, I would want to follow up to make sure the unit was right.

Can you ask them if you can ship the unit back, and have them fix everything that is wrong? I know for you it would mean some down time for your business, but the way things are now do not seem to be conducive to productivity anyway.

Is Laguna willing to send you a new unit as soon as the new shipment arrives, and you return the unit you have? There has got to be a way to get this rectified. Maybe you should get one person at Laguna who you can have as an on-going representative for your situation, and deal with them as the one who knows all the history, and not get the "I'll transfer you, and put on hold, and I'm not sure, I'll have to check with someone else" run-a-round any more.

I just find it hard to understand that a company such as Laguna does not take a pro-active solution oriented approach to this.

That being said, it is true that we are only getting your side of the issue, [that is not a dig against you at all] and maybe there are things at Laguna that could hopefully explain all the delays and problems in getting this solved.

I hope this all gets rectified in the very near future....good luck Kevin!

 

[kevinkabby]

Incompetence is the reason for all of the problems of shipping replacement parts. I now will only deal with the second in command at the company.

I could have sent the unit back, I could send it back today. I have absolutely no faith in the company. If I ship it back and they say that they aren't going to give full reimbursement. That would leave me in a tight situation. Starting a business, money is always tight. I would have to pony up enough to buy another one, then wait for them to reimburse me. The lathe works, but not like it should. It is more of the frustration, dealing with people who have no clue on how to do their specific job. I stopped dealing with the customer service people there a long time ago, but then my sales rep(who lied through his teeth to get the sale) quit. At least he got the job done.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Is it still under warranty?

Incompetence is the reason for all of the problems of shipping replacement parts. I now will only deal with the second in command at the company.

I could have sent the unit back, I could send it back today. I have absolutely no faith in the company. If I ship it back and they say that they aren't going to give full reimbursement. That would leave me in a tight situation. Starting a business, money is always tight. I would have to pony up enough to buy another one, then wait for them to reimburse me. The lathe works, but not like it should. It is more of the frustration, dealing with people who have no clue on how to do their specific job. I stopped dealing with the customer service people there a long time ago, but then my sales rep(who lied through his teeth to get the sale) quit. At least he got the job done.

Kevin,

Not being in your shoes, and not having a business as it relates to using a lathe, I do not know for sure what I would do in your case.

That being said, I think that I would document everything that I could and try to get a new unit from them from the next shipment they receive and then ship the other one back to them in the crate the new one came in, unless you still have the old crate.

I understand trust.....are you concerned that if you ship it back that they won't follow through with shipping a new one? If so, then I would document with pictures, serial numbers, witnesses from at least 2 other people [such as the electrician you had bypass the switch,] and I would speak to a consumer advocate or the state commission in charge of consumer complaints and see if they would take some initiative to get Laguna to rectify the situation for you.

Most companies do not want to have any negative dealings with the state consumer protection people, because they can make life hard on the company if they want to. [just a thought, but I would try to have some additional means to get this rectified]

What amazes me is most all of the other posters on this line up of lathes speak highly of their unit, and are happy. I know I have not had the first problem with my Grizzly G0698 to date, and I am very pleased with its performance.

Good luck as you proceed to get your issues resolved. Regards.

 

[Roger Chandler]

torque to spare

I turned a hollowed out vase from a Chinese chesnut log this morning, and used my Ellsworth hollowing tools for the first time. The log was mostly dry and had certainly hardened a good bit from when I first got it a few months ago.

The hollowing process really put a lot of torque and stress on my hands and forarm and the bent Ellsworth tool was a lot to try and control free hand. While I got the job done and the tools worked well, I was really supprised at how much torque was transferred in the hollowing process.

The Grizzly G0698 handled the hollowing just fine, and had torque to spare. The lathe did not even bog down. I used the low belt setting, and turned mostly in the 650 to 950 rpm range, using the slower speed for the bent tool and the higher for the straight tool.

This lathe is quiet and smooth, has wonderful performance and set up for different configurations. I had the head stock at about a 3rd of the length from the left end of the bed, and took the tail stock off, and turned off the end with the long handled Ellsworth hollowing tools. It really worked very well, and was a step up from the Sorby Hollowmaster that was the other tool I have worked with previously.

I see why a lot of folks use a captured handle rig for hollowing.... I might just have to invest in one myself. It takes a lot of strength to do it the way I did today

This Grizzly G0698 lathe rocks!

 

[Roger Chandler]

Vacuum Chuck

I purchased a vacuum chuck system for the G0698 this past week. It is the Hold Fast System and I got both the 6 inch vacuum head and the 3 inch one as well. I also had made a home made version 4 inches following the article in the June AAW Journal using the trex decking and a pvc coupling 2" to 4" and it will work fine when I put a seal on it.

I have not had a chance as of yet to do a turning on it, but I have set it up, and learned how it works, and have put some wood on it to test the unit, which is a venturi unit, that works off compressed air.

When I get a chance to turn another project, I will let everyone know how it worked out!

 

[William Young]

I turned a hollowed out vase from a Chinese chesnut log this morning, and used my Ellsworth hollowing tools for the first time. The log was mostly dry and had certainly hardened a good bit from when I first got it a few months ago.

The hollowing process really put a lot of torque and stress on my hands and forarm and the bent Ellsworth tool was a lot to try and control free hand. While I got the job done and the tools worked well, I was really supprised at how much torque was transferred in the hollowing process.

The Grizzly G0698 handled the hollowing just fine, and had torque to spare. The lathe did not even bog down. I used the low belt setting, and turned mostly in the 650 to 950 rpm range, using the slower speed for the bent tool and the higher for the straight tool.

This lathe is quiet and smooth, has wonderful performance and set up for different configurations. I had the head stock at about a 3rd of the length from the left end of the bed, and took the tail stock off, and turned off the end with the long handled Ellsworth hollowing tools. It really worked very well, and was a step up from the Sorby Hollowmaster that was the other tool I have worked with previously.

I see why a lot of folks use a captured handle rig for hollowing.... I might just have to invest in one myself. It takes a lot of strength to do it the way I did today

This Grizzly G0698 lathe rocks!

.

I only have the HollowMaster RS230KT . Mine leaves a lot desired and the wheel is a bear to sharpen .
I will look up the Ellseworth one or maybe you can post a link to it .
Would love to see a picture of the one you just finished.
I agree with your quiet and smooth and wonderful performance comments of your lathe . Mine is A Craftex CT128 (same thing)

 

[William Young]

I purchased a vacuum chuck system for the G0698 this past week. It is the Hold Fast System and I got both the 6 inch vacuum head and the 3 inch one as well. I also had made a home made version 4 inches following the article in the June AAW Journal using the trex decking and a pvc coupling 2" to 4" and it will work fine when I put a seal on it.

I have not had a chance as of yet to do a turning on it, but I have set it up, and learned how it works, and have put some wood on it to test the unit, which is a venturi unit, that works off compressed air.

When I get a chance to turn another project, I will let everyone know how it worked out!

I got one of those back when I had my little Jet 1220 . It worked just great. I made several chucks for it.
I have not been able to find a piece of lamp rod long enough yet to go through the head stock of the Craftex CT128 so I have been using Cole jaws or donut chucks until I do.

 

[Roger Chandler]

Pic of Chinese chestnut vase

William,

here is a pic of the vase I hollowed using the Ellsworth tools. About 6 inches high and 4 inches wide.

The Ellsworth tools are just the steel part, I had to turn the handles myself, but it was fun and I enjoyed doing it. They need to be long......27-29 inches, and turned eliptical on the handle end to give you more control and ability to control the torque generated by the hollowing process.