What wood change with UV

[john lucas]

Yea I know, all woods will turn to barnwood if left out long enough but I thought it would be interesting to see what woods you have used that change fairly rapidly. If you sell your work do you either avoid these woods or do you tell the customer what to expect. Have you had any bad experiences due to this problem?
Osage Orange changes from bright yellow to a sort of Okra or rich tan color. It changes fairly quickly if left in the sun but it takes 3 to 5 years to change very much in the house.
Purple heart looks brown after you turn it but changes to purple in just a couple of days in the shop. It will change in a few hours if left in the sun. It holds this color for a long time.
Padauk changes from a very bright orange or burnt orange color to a deep sort of burgundy brown in less than a year indoors. It's a very pretty color but not nearly as wild as when it's first turned and finished.
Box Elder will lost the red in one day if left in the sun. The red changes to a tan color over a period of years although it sort of starts at the edges and the center part of the red will take a lot longer. Bleaching makes the red stand out longer but it doesn't stop it from changing color.
Mulberry loses some colors and keeps some others. It's pretty orange at first but this is the color that goes the fastest. Most of the deeper colors stay for a long time.
We all know about Cherry which doesn't change as dramatically as the ones mentioned above and most people like the color of aged cherry.
some Mahagony woods I've worked with will darken at about the same rate as cherry.
I don't sell a lot of the woods mentioned above but I do try to tell my customers what will happen. I don't think they really understand however. They nod their head but I'm not sure they really understand how much it changes, expecially box elder. I used to keep an old Osage Orange bowl around to show customers and I don't sell a new Osage orange piece until it's lost some of the brightness.
I don't have a lot of experience with different finishes but none of the ones I've tried have had a significant affect. The only one seems to work at all is Spar Varnish and that's just not a good finish for my work, it yellows too much. I've tried some of the car waxes and Armour All and I could not tell that they did anything at all.

 

[Bill Turpin]

I have dyed purpleheart

I have turned several PH pens for wounded veterans who have the PH medals. I used water based Transtint dyes to make sure the wood stays purple. As it slowly turns brown, the purple is still there.

I also believe that there sare everal variaties of trees called PH. They have very different characteristics. They are exact opposites with the color changes. I have one chunk that has not lost any purple after five years in the sun. I wish I had a ton of it!

Bill in WNC mountains

 

[Hugh]

John,
My stuff is inside stuff. I do warn people who purchase Osage Orange items that the color is going to change. Something that you may want to try is a spray can from Krylon - UV Resist or some name like that. I purchased a can at the art store. I used it on a couple of things but never did really test them in the sun or anything like that. What I should have done is taken a piece of Osage and sprayed half with the UV Resist and then put Deft on the whole thing and put it out where it would be exposed to the sun. Just never got around to it.
Hugh

 

[john lucas]

Hugh I haven't done any extensive testing on wood but we did try a lot of finishes on digital photo posters at work. We tried the Krylon UV, Spar Varnish, regular lacquer and shellac and polyeurthanes and several products we found at the automotive stores that claimed to have UV protection. We put the photos in the east facing window so they got morning sun only. All of the photos faded badly within one week with only the Spar Varnish one showing some UV protection. Of course you really don't want the spar varnish color on a photo.
I have run some simple tests on box elder and Osage using my favorite lacquers, the Krylon UV, Armour-all, and an automotive wax (I think it was Turtle wax but it's been too long). Non of them worked worth a darn when hit by direct sunlight. In fact the test board with no finish lasted just about as long.

 

[hockenbery]

John,

I advise people not to display wood in direct sunlight.
If I'm making the sale directly I do tell customers that all wood changes color over time.

If they mention the color being their primary interest I tell them what can happen.

I had one customer who bought a boxelder salad bowl who gave me annual reports for about 5 years that it was still red inside and they were using 3-4 time a week.
I suppose the salad provides a light barrier.

On Paduk: I think it along with cherry keep getting better
To me the old paduk that get an ebony black is even nicer than the bright red/orange



happy turning,
Al

 

[S. Clark]

When color is important to the outcome, I try and design for the color that will be, not the one that is. My experience is that there exists a harmony with these tones and the transitional colors leading to the finale. I like to turn fruitless mulberry. It starts as a bright yellow and is quite stunning. It ages to a warm golden brown which has a depth of tone that is unique. When I’m applying color or considering texture I refer to samples of the aged material.

I always tell customers about the color change with wood. I describe it as a unique character trait which gives the piece life and additional interest.

 

[Rob Wallace]

Differences in 'Fruitless' mulberry.....???

When color is important to the outcome, I try and design for the color that will be, not the one that is. My experience is that there exists a harmony with these tones and the transitional colors leading to the finale. I like to turn fruitless mulberry. It starts as a bright yellow and is quite stunning. It ages to a warm golden brown which has a depth of tone that is unique. When I’m applying color or considering texture I refer to samples of the aged material.

What a great idea to have an aged color reference around for some of these photoreactive woods - I'll have to start a reference set and keep it on hand for use while turning and as a teaching model for when I give my "Complexity and Diversity of Wood" talk.

Regarding "fruitless" mulberry..... Mulberry is mulberry - probably one species in your area, but you are selecting male plants. Mulberry has separate male and female trees (a reproductive condition known as being dioecious), and you must be selecting wood from male trees, which are "fruitless" (.... although your efforts to turn this wood are not fruitless!); only the female trees can bear fruit (which technically are not 'berries' but are multiple fruits of drupes).

I am curious to know whether you have turned and compared wood between "fruitless" and "fruited" (male and female, respectively) mulberry, and if you have noticed differences enough to prefer 'fruitless' mulberry?? In theory, there should be no difference, but I'd like to learn of any differences experienced by anyone turning male vs. female mulberry wood.....

Interesting thread....

Rob Wallace

 

[Michael Stafford]

Padauk, peroba rosa and Goncalo alves all turn dark very quickly in a room brightly lit by sunshine even if they are never in direct sunshine. This has happened to some boxes (flatwork) that I built for my wife for her sewing room. The pink of the peroba rosa is now just a muddy brown as are the others. Of course the original color remains on the inside.

Cherry will suntan almost immediately if left out in the sun. As a matter of fact you can place a leaf on a freshly planed board in direct sunshine and come back in an hour and a shadow of the leaf will be there when you lift the leaf. Leave it longer and the wood surrounding it will get progressively darker.

 

[Barbara Gill]

Regarding "fruitless" mulberry..... Mulberry is mulberry - probably one species in your area, but you are selecting male plants. Mulberry has separate male and female trees (a reproductive condition known as being dioecious), and you must be selecting wood from male trees, which are "fruitless" (.... although your efforts to turn this wood are not fruitless!); only the female trees can bear fruit (which technically are not 'berries' but are multiple fruits of drupes).

I am curious to know whether you have turned and compared wood between "fruitless" and "fruited" (male and female, respectively) mulberry, and if you have noticed differences enough to prefer 'fruitless' mulberry?? In theory, there should be no difference, but I'd like to learn of any differences experienced by anyone turning male vs. female mulberry wood.....

Interesting thread....

Rob Wallace

Actually here in Eastern VA we have a variety of White Mulberry that does not have fruit. It was brought in for the silk industry that never went anywhere. The tree is a terrible pest. The wood is light and does not appear to be photo reactive as is the Red Mulberry.

 

[Ron Sardo]

I've noticed that bubinga doesn't change color very much over the years.

I know of a table and some cabinets that are over 10 years old and the color looks the same as freshly finished bubinga. (tung oil)

The table is in an area that gets plenty of morning sunlight from very large windows. Of course this is only one sample.

All the cherry that I've seen changed color quite a bit.

 

[Michael Stafford]

I almost forgot to include this in this thread.

I have a friend who collects antique document boxes. I have used some of them as inspiration for jewelry boxes I build. (Gasp, flatwork, I know!!!)

We were visiting and he pulled out an old document box and asked me what wood did I think it was. It was as dark brown and rich in color as Pennsylvania cherry. My immediate response without really studying the wood was "cherry."

Of course I was wrong and he told me to really look closely and when I did under that rich brown color were birdseyes, lots of them. I opened the box and looked inside and protected from exposure to light and the oxidation of the atmosphere was the rich golden color of birdseye maple. This box was over 200 years old and the exterior maple had oxidized to the color of cherry.

I guess the moral of the story is that no matter what colorful exotic or figured wood we use the only thing that will matter in 200 years is the form and function of the object.