Washcoat on spalted stopper?

[Jamie Straw]

I'm finishing a wine stopper as a gift, wood is spalted alder. Plan to finish it with lacquer, but my brain is wanting to put a wash-coat of shellac on it first. Is my brain right? -- the wood is not punky, just spalted, though the end-grain is a bit open.

 

[Bill Boehme]

No. Well, you probably could, but why? By "wash coat", I presume that you mean a sanding sealer. Shellac can be used as a sanding sealer for oil based finishes like polyurethane. For lacquer, I think that it might be better if you made a sealer by cutting lacquer 50-50 with lacquer thinner.

 

[Jamie Straw]

No. Well, you probably could, but why? By "wash coat", I presume that you mean a sanding sealer. Shellac can be used as a sanding sealer for oil based finishes like polyurethane. For lacquer, I think that it might be better if you made a sealer by cutting lacquer 50-50 with lacquer thinner.

OK, thanks Bill. Back in pre-turning days, I used wash-coats a lot on alder and soft maple. I think it was just an instinctive impulse.

 

[hockenbery]

Jamie,

I use shellac with double the alcohol. It acts as a sanding sealer and Wood stiffener for punchy wood that needs more than water.

This helps keep endgrain from getting blotchy.

Pretty much any surface treatment that work on flat wood will work on round wood.
The one difference we wood turners have is we can not hide the end grain like the furniture makers.

 

[john lucas]

Certainly you could but I use thinned lacquer. I use to use shellac on wine stoppers but the alcohol in the wine can ruin the finish if spill it on the wine stopper. You did say that you were putting something non alcohol solvent as a final finish so that should work.

 

[Jamie Straw]

Certainly you could but I use thinned lacquer. I use to use shellac on wine stoppers but the alcohol in the wine can ruin the finish if spill it on the wine stopper. You did say that you were putting something non alcohol solvent as a final finish so that should work.

How much do you thin the lacquer? I plan to get a quart of lacquer, and have lacquer thinner, but have actually never finished anything with lacquer other than with Deft spray. I've read your post about 2 quick lacquer coats and a spinning French Polish, was going to try that.

 

[Jamie Straw]

Jamie,

I use shellac with double the alcohol. It acts as a sanding sealer and Wood stiffener for punchy wood that needs more than water.

This helps keep endgrain from getting blotchy.

Pretty much any surface treatment that work on flat wood will work on round wood.
The one difference we wood turners have is we can not hide the end grain like the furniture makers.

How blotchy can something get if you don't stain it? I guess the lacquer might gum up in the pores and affect the following coats. I used to do a lot of wet-sanding on case goods (mostly large shadow-boxes) to fill things up. Made some real pretty finishes that way.😎

 

[hockenbery]

How blotchy can something get if you don't stain it? I guess the lacquer might gum up in the pores and affect the following coats. I used to do a lot of wet-sanding on case goods (mostly large shadow-boxes) to fill things up. Made some real pretty finishes that way.😎

If I use a finish like waterlox, watch, etc on maple without using a sealer ( thin shellac) the engrain will darken more and unevenly than the face and side grain.
A bit like what you would with a stain or dye.

I usually prefer a clear finish on maple if it is close to white to keep the white. On some maple the amber cast of the waterlox is a nice warm finish.
Clear finishes don't darken the endgrain for me.

Al

 

[Jamie Straw]

Spalted maple?

I usually prefer a clear finish on maple if it is close to white to keep the white. On some maple the amber cast of the waterlox is a nice warm finish.
Clear finishes don't darken the endgrain for me.

Al

Do you work much with spalted maple, Al? If so, what do you prefer when finishing it (Waterlox on that?)? It's one of my favorite woods, and fairly easy to come by in the NW.

 

[Bill Boehme]

I turn a lot of figured maple and usually finish with gloss spray lacquer. I think that lacquer gives the least amount of darkening and the least amount of amber tint of any type of finish. If you want an amber tint then shellac sanding sealer (1 lb. cut shellac) should work. Super blonde dewaxed shellac gives the least amount of amber tint.

On spalted wood, it depends on whether the wood is still solid or if it is getting a bit soft. There is a product called Minwax Wood Hardener that might be good for punky wood, but don't use too much or else the wood will become too hard to turn.

Something important to know about finishes is that the glossier you want it to be, the darker it will look. The reason is that a matte finish or unfinished wood scatters light more than a gloss finish. Basically, light scattering lowers contrast so it's like having a white veil covering the object. A glossy finish enhances detail, but that also means that overall, the colors in the wood will be more vibrant. You can even see this effect when sanding bare wood to a very high grit. I frequently use Micromesh up to 12,000 grit. As the wood begins to take on a gloss at about 4000 grit, the colors start to become more intense and darker.

 

[hockenbery]

Do you work much with spalted maple, Al? If so, what do you prefer when finishing it (Waterlox on that?)? It's one of my favorite woods, and fairly easy to come by in the NW.

I don't often work with salted maple. What look really nice is to bleach spalted maple.
The black lines stay black and wood gets white. I did this a lot with Christmas ornaments.

Can't find any photos of those.

Below are photos of maple hollow forms show the difference with waterlox and clear finish.

Left and right are maple burls with some salting finished with waterlox.
The one on the right the interior is bleached The two in the middle are finished with one of the clear water based finishes.
The effects are quite different. The waterlox darkens the wood and gives it an amber cast. I like them all.

The,piece with the partly cut rim is about 6" diameter. The others are 13-14" diameter

Al

 

[Jamie Straw]

Al, thanks for the pictures and descriptions. They are beautiful, and it's interesting to see the differences in finish. Do you use oxalic acid to bleach?

 

[hockenbery]

Al, thanks for the pictures and descriptions. They are beautiful, and it's interesting to see the differences in finish. Do you use oxalic acid to bleach?

I tried oxalic once did not work at all.

I use the two part Klean Strip bleach. It is cleverly called part A and Part B.

There was a good thread on bleaching a while ago and the AAW Journal had a great article last year about the make up of the Klean Strip bleach and a recipe for making your own.

The Klean strip used to be sold in pint bottles at places like Home Depot. It is quite caustic but I never considers it especially hazardous. Wear goggles and nitrile gloves. Now it is not available in the small bottles. we bought a gallon of each which is darned expensive. Fortunately it lasts forever.

It takes me years to use the pint containers. Now I've got a 30 year supply.... And I may not use it all.

Al