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Using Tormek for Ellsworth??

K

KEW

Joined
Jun 9, 2005
Messages
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Location
North Metro Atlanta
Recently, the following instruction was posted on a Tormek forum by a Tormek sales rep. I believe Torgney (sp?) who "invented" the Tormek was supposed to have derived this instruction.
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"You need a tool protrusion of 3 inches and set the jig past the 5 an amount equal to the space between the 4 and 5. These settings will match the profile of the Ellsworth gouge precisely."
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I attempted this grinding operation (starting with 60 degrees at the nose) and ended up with a bowl gouge with sides which were less than 45 degrees.
Has anyone attempted an Ellsworth grind using these instruction? What was your result.

I suspect I'll either end up sticking with my dry grinder or make a jig to hold the Ellsworth "vari-grind" jig, but thought I'd check here first.

Thanks,
Kurt Whitley
 
This is an important rule to remember:
Whatever tool or jig that you use only controls the angle that the tool is presented to the grinder. It is up to you to control how much material to grind away.
​
I use a Tormek and experimentally arrived at settings that are quite close to the ones that are now being published in the Tormek manual. I also have an Ellsworth jig that I have used on a dry grinder and I get essentially the same results in both cases. But, if you do not pay careful attention to what you are grinding, you can wind up with very sharp wings and a narrow nose.

For what it is worth, there is absolutely nothing to prevent you from using the Ellsworth jig on your Tormek.

What yo will need to do now is grind away a significant amount of metal from the nose so that you can reshape the tool.

Bill
 
KEW said:
......I suspect I'll either end up sticking with my dry grinder or make a jig to hold the Ellsworth "vari-grind" jig..............
Click to expand...
Are you confusing the Ellsworth jig and the Varigrind jig? They are not the same thing. If you already have the Wolverine, it will hold either the Varigrind (which was made for the Wolverine) or the Ellsworth jig.

Bill
 
Ellsworth grind

Since I already had an Ellsworth grind, it should have required a minimum of material to be removed. I knew I was losing the true Ellsworth grind as I was doing it (only ground one side of the tool so I can compare symmetry). Right now that gouge will be my test gouge until I get the final settings (or system) correct for the Tormek. I also have two Crown Masterflutes which I reshaped to Ellsworth grinds on the dry grinder.
I'm willing to allow for some variation, but don't like the look of what I ended up with (seems like cutting at the wings will be "grabby" using the side cuts I have gotten comfortable with). I am willing to lose some tool life to experimentation, but probably put too much faith in the supplied settings.
I have been grinding using the Ellsworth jig, and have been able to maintain a proper Ellsworth grind using it. I have a new Ellsworth gouge on order just to verify that I haven't drifted, but I have always made careful use of the marker technique and think I'm not far off.

Do you feel that you get a true Ellsworth grind from the settings in the book (which I believe use a different projection from the ones I posted). I have read several places that these settings wouldn't really get you there and that was my experience. The settings I posted were the first place I've seen which stated to obtain an Ellsworth grind PRECISELY.
 
KEW said:
Do you feel that you get a true Ellsworth grind from the settings in the book (which I believe use a different projection from the ones I posted). I have read several places that these settings wouldn't really get you there and that was my experience. The settings I posted were the first place I've seen which stated to obtain an Ellsworth grind PRECISELY.
Click to expand...
If you go to the Tormek web site and open the PDF file for the latest version of the manual, it gives the same settings that you gave -- 3" projection and JS=6, where you have to extrapolate where the 6 would be based on the spacing between 4 and 5. You can vary these numbers to give the results that you like. The protrusion is the primary adjsutment to control the angle on the wings and the JS is the primary adjustment for controlling the length of the wings.

BTW, not even the Ellsworth jig will give a precise "Ellsworth grind" -- jigs only determine the angle and not the shape.
 
Last edited:
Thanks!

I'll give it another try taking the rules you gave me into consideration.

"BTW, not even the Ellsworth jig will give a precise "Ellsworth grind" -- jigs only determine the angle and not the shape."

You are right, of course. I should have said CAPABLE of replicating the Ellsworth grind!

Thanks again, I appreciate your help!
 
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