Turning Bowls

[Paul M. Kaplowitz]

A member of my wood turning club hollows bowls starting at the center and cutting up to the rim. I had never seen anyone do that. He is self taught and said he is more comfortable doing it that way. Does anyone else out there use a guage that way and if so what is the benifit?

 

[Darryl Fective]

If it's end grain, that's probably a better way to do it because the fibers are supported. (cutting downhill)

For side grain, it's better to hollow from rim to center to keep the downhill support and enjoy less tear out.

 

[hockenbery]

He is self taught and said he is more comfortable doing it that way.

comfort would be the benefit on face grain bowls.
the fibers are not supported by the cut and will tend to tear more.

I knew a wheel chair bound turner who did something similar on the bottom third of the bowl.
hollowed down from the rim about 2/3s then switched going center out

 

[Brian Gustin]

I will often do that myself, I can take deeper, more aggressive cuts using a bit less than half of the whole wing and nose of the ellsworth grind gouge so it makes hollowing out the bowl go VERY fast. Granted it does lead to massive tear-out and not much fine control of where the cut goes, but until you are getting close (perhaps within 1/4 inch) of final thickness, it doesn't really matter a lot - I just anchor tool to the rest, rest close in, and swivel the gouge around on that pivot point with flute open quite a bit more than shear scraping, (maybe 10:00 or so, I think - never paid attention) pretty much riding the side bevel or somewhere close to it. It doesn't stall out my HF lathe like it sometimes does when I try to take big deep cuts on the outside of the bowl. I, as well, am self-taught, so probably is something that might have been frowned on by others, but I find it quite comfortable too.

 

[Michael Anderson]

I would be curious to see the state of his finished bowls. How consistent is the wall thickness? How much tear out is present? And if not much, at what grit does he start sanding to get rid of the tearout? Rhetorical questions.

 

[David Martin]

I have no experience to base an opinion on so therefore I don't have one. From watching videos I have noticed though that Kent (Turn A Bowl) likes to work from the rim to the center, and Richard Raffan likes to hollow the center first. I am not in a position to doubt either one. I saw a video yesterday of Kent warning of the dangers of using a spindle gouge for bowl turning. The next video in line was "Richard Raffan Turns a Bowl With A Spindle Gouge", and he does, start to finish. Richard Raffans prefered tools for bowl turning seem to be a spindle gouge and a bowl scraper. Who's right? I'm guesing that the answer is probably both.

 

[Dean Center]

I do that sometimes. With the hole from the screw chuck as a starting point, it's pretty easy to pull the tool across the face, leaving a stepped surface on the inside of the bowl, then using those steps as a starting point for a rim to center pass with the gouge. It's not something I teach beginners, but it feels like the right way to go, sometimes. With the last 2-3 passes of the gouge in the downhill direction, I don't think it leaves any worse surface than hogging out the waste in the other direction. It violates almost all of Stuart Batty's goals in using the 40/40, which is kinda peculiar.

 

[Randy Anderson]

When roughing out I'll do both bottom out and inside edge down working a stepped cone shape down until I get close to where I want to be. Final passes are in toward the bottom. For natural edge bowls I do center out pull cuts to keep the bottom flat or sloped inward as I work the edges down, knowing I likely can't come back up to the top rim with a gouge after I get in and some mass at near the same level as the sides helps keep it stable. I almost never do end grain bowls.

 

[robo hippy]

I believe that Brian Havens did the plastic straw thing to demonstrate why you do finish cuts from base to rim on the outside, and rim to base on the inside. So, take a C or U shaped bowl, and stack short segments of plastic straws on the line. Almost no resistance one direction, and huge resistance the other direction. Cutting with the grain will leave a cleaner surface on any side grain bowl form. That means less sanding, which to me is the purpose of finish cuts. With roughing cuts, I still go the same way. Yes, I do use scrapers for my roughing cuts, and yes, the surface is rather rough, but that, to me, is why it is called a roughing cut. One pass with a gouge and it is cleaned up.

robo hippy

 

[Kevin Jenness]

I have no experience to base an opinion on so therefore I don't have one. From watching videos I have noticed though that Kent (Turn A Bowl) likes to work from the rim to the center, and Richard Raffan likes to hollow the center first. I am not in a position to doubt either one. I saw a video yesterday of Kent warning of the dangers of using a spindle gouge for bowl turning. The next video in line was "Richard Raffan Turns a Bowl With A Spindle Gouge", and he does, start to finish. Richard Raffans prefered tools for bowl turning seem to be a spindle gouge and a bowl scraper. Who's right? I'm guesing that the answer is probably both.

I think they are talking about two different types of spindle gouge. A spindle roughing gouge with its wide flute and relatively small shank is susceptible to large catches and breakage on side grain work whereas a smaller spindle gouge with a round shank is safer. Plus, a highly experienced turner like Raffan could probably turn perfectly well with a sharp runcible spoon.

 

[Rusty Nesmith]

On an end grain bowl a pull cut works a lot better than a push cut on the inside. On side grain you will get a lot more rear out that way. I will sometimes cut the wrong direction but I always do a finish cut in the correct direction to get rid of any tear out.

 

[Doug Freeman]

Richard Raffans prefered tools for bowl turning seem to be a spindle gouge and a bowl scraper.

Spindle vs bowl gouge - its all about tool extension off the rest. For the same size shaft a BG is significantly stiffer due to the x-section of the fluted tool. Mr Raffan does use a BG, mainly for bowl ID’s.

Using round shaft SG’s is ok, but they will chatter with less overhang vs a BG. The warning of not using SG’s on face grain relates to when tools were forged with flat steel, and had weaker tangs vs a round shaft at the handle - the tang being MUCH easier to bend or break. Its all about how much cutting edge is in the wood and the strength of the steel (due to x-section) at the handle insertion.

You want to be carful with how much cutting edge is used (and depth) with a scraper with a tang for the same reason. I think the roughing scrapers @robo hippy uses have thick x-sections going into the handle.

For hollowing a bowl, for end grain dont waste your time trying to go rim to center, rough and finish. For roughing face grain, center to rim works pretty well with a long wing, and in fact you have to be careful to not get too much wing into the cut.

For roughing its all about the physics of the process - a torn surface can be cleaned up with finish cuts. For finish cuts its all about getting clean cuts -sharp tools, light cuts, correct cutting direction of the grain.

 

[Breck Whitworth]

I turn hundreds of bowls per year many very large bowls. When roughing a bowl I could care less if there is a smooth finish or any tear out because it is just a roughed out bowl that needs to dry before finish turning it. When production turning it's time not quality I worry about. Now when it's time for finishing a dry bowl then everything is in play because the smoother the final cuts the less sanding I have to do, Again everything is about time to me. My final product must have good form and an impeccable finish. My advice to bowl turners is to find what works the best for you and do it until you find a better way then do it that way. The day I quit learning is my last day turning more than likely.

 

[Dennis J Gooding]

A member of my wood turning club hollows bowls starting at the center and cutting up to the rim. I had never seen anyone do that. He is self taught and said he is more comfortable doing it that way. Does anyone else out there use a guage that way and if so what is the benifit?

I believe that there is a bit of ambiguity here. He could be making pull cuts against the grain or he could be making short cuts with the grain and working his way from center to rim.