• It's time to cast your vote in the January 2025 Turning Challenge. (click here for details)
  • Conversations are now Direct Messages (click here for details)
  • Congratulations to Alan Weinberg for "Elm Burl Bowl" being selected as Turning of the Week for January 27, 2025 (click here for details)
  • Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

Toolroom expansion tool layout--HELP

Don C Davis

Don C Davis

Joined
Feb 15, 2018
Messages
256
Likes
64
Location
Canton, GA
I have a contractor that I love, but he is slow as cold--very cold-molasses--having said that I am trying to be positive about the time delays, so I thought I would ask here for advice on tool placement--the tools that will be going into this space are a Grizzly 10" table saw, a Rikon 10-326 bandsaw, a Lagua 24-36 lathe, a Laguna MJOIN 80-20 (an 8 inch jointer), a Rikon 6x48 belt/disc sander, a Rikon 12" helical planer, a Supermax 19-38
drum sander, and a few odd & end table mounted tools--i.e. Balder sharpening buffer, Byrne model machine table saw, and grand finale a C-Max dust collection unit from Clear-Vue with the standing filters and the 'pick-up box'

having said that I am seeking a layout for the above tools that makes sense--I am planning on using CPVC plumbing pipe for the DC with a main run of 8 or 6" and 4" drops to that main tools--the table saw, the bandsaw, the drum sander and the planer and belt/disc sander. So any input on this would also be appreciated. I searched on the health and safety forum and all I found was various discrepancy oriented posts re the dust collection rigs themselves.

Thanks for any input/advice
 
I have my lathe in the corner, and if I could change things now, I'd make plenty of walk-around room all the way around the lathe. You will be cleaning up quite a lot, and this makes that task a little more user-friendly! :D

-----odie-----
 
My suggestion is be flexible in wiring, air piping and dust collector ducting. Don't lock yourself into machine locations until you've worked in the shop for a time.

One thing my electrician did that I might not have thought of was having the 115V duplex receptacles around the shop perimeter on different breakers. In other words, each of the two halves of a duplex receptacle in a given box are on their own breaker so at any location you can have two 15 amp motors plugged into the same box.

All wiring is exposed in rigid conduit making changes easy without tearing into drywall. There are a couple of drop cords from the ceiling so machines located mid shop don't have cords running across the floor.

The one thing he skimped on was not enough 230V outlets around the shop, but with the exposed conduit it was easy to add more myself.
 
Good thing for your electrician. You can mark the outlets so you know which outlets are on a certain breaker. I had to add a line in my shop. The original house had an unfinished basement and had four outlets in the whole basement! The guy that sold me the house paneled part of the basement for home schooling and didn't add one extra outlet. I have to shut off the heater in the den to run anything in the shop on that circuit. Ah, mesuggah!
 
Shop layout should be based on what kind of work you do. Usually a work flow from where you bring in the material, towards where you do the finishing. Best advice, put the planer as close to the dust collector as you can. Just curious, what does the contractor complaint have to do with shop layout?
 
I have similar equipment that you have. First size; my shop is 30' X 50' and I have 12' ceiling. I have hot water in floor heat, but no AC. I have a 8' X 8' bathroom and sink. I took a 10' wide by 16' deep section by building a wall for my lawn mower, gator and yard equipment. I did this because I did not want to maintain a second out building. It has its own overhead door and the end is open. I had my electrical also run in conduit for ease of change and reduce cold air into the shop. I was surprised on how much cold air came through the outlets. I had three 220v run, one for the lathe, one for the DC, and one the saw and jointer have a common plug. A lot of 110v all around the shop. I am fortunate I can vent my DC outside and do so using a Escarda cyclone ( from eBay about $200). I used 6" metal duct for my DC. I used metal because I wanted good 6" blast gates from Lee Valley. I don't beieve the Lee Valley gates fit plastic. I am partial to metal and metal eliminates the age old static argument with plastic. I decided on placement of tools that were not very movable such as the lathe and table saw, secondly on those I use a lot such as the band saw. The remainder are on wheels and moveable easily into a work area. I have four major DC drops. There are 6" wyes at each of them. One is dedicated to the table saw that has ample room all around the saw. The wye there is reduced to 4" with one leg to the saw and the other to the overarm guard/dust collection. Another drop is to the lathe with on leg to the lathe and another to the hand held floor sweep. I have drop for some small sanders and band saws. This is mostly a waste as I am using a shop vac for the small sanders and the band saw DC is terrible. The last DC drop is for my miter saw and my general wheeled tools such as planer, jointer, drum sander. I just pull them out and hook them up as used. Tool placement; an on going thing, but now somewhat stable. I have my lathe 90 degrees from the wall. I can get all the way around it easily. I initially had it parallel to the wall with no access to the back and very limited end access.

These are some initial pictures. The shopsmith is long gone and the sanders have moved against the wall with the drill press and band saw.

IMG_1979.JPG IMG_1978.JPG IMG_1981.JPG IMG_1984.JPG
 
Thanks John

I guess one point is not trying to place every tool. You need to place tools that are difficult to move. I built this shop when I retired. I wanted in floor heat (hate cold toes), 12' ceiling, and bathroom. I lucked out on the ceiling as they were re-configuring a Boarders store and I got the panels and some track free. I bought most of the cabinets from school auctions.
 
Free? Auctions? And I thought I was cheap. I'm so cheap, they have my picture next to the word in the dictionary. Good way to re-purpose things that would otherwise go into a landfill. I do have a school locker that I labeled and store a lot of tools- pliers, adjustable wrenches, portable tools, etc. Free, to boot!
 
I designed and built boat interiors for years. My customers were usually gruff fisherman, and they didn't like it...but I always gave them the same homework assignment:

Go home with 1/4" graph paper (four squares = one inch) and draw out everything you wanted to fit into the space as plan view (ie. bird eye) to-scale cut-outs, and move them around until you get the best compromise. I usually gave the same assignment to customers who wanted offices and new kitchens. I recommend doing this with your shop and large tools. Consider moving in the space, ducting, wiring, etc.

This will inevitably involve a period of foul language, but the process is always worth it. Every customer I gave the assignment to ended up thanking me.

Once your drawing is semi-complete, you draw things full size on the floor in blue tape outlines as best you can.

I did this with my dinky shop and I didn't like the exercise, but like my customers, I'm glad I did.
 
As my shop is rectangular with a gabled roof and the ceiling follows the rake. I ran around the walls at mid-height with a dozen or so double outlets then across the ceiling with the same. Now I can move any of my gear anywhere I want and the overhead outlets are generally used for power tools and lighting.
 
Don
I have very little that I can add regarding your workshop layout but I am somewhat concerned regarding your plans for dust collecting.
I assume that your shop is for a single worker and you are unlikely to have more than one machine operating and producing dust at any one time.
What size dust collector are you planning to use? If your DC can pull 1400 -1500 REAL CFM then 6" ducting is sufficient. If It can pull 1800-2200 REAL CFM through the ducting then 8" may be more appropriate. Don't believe most manufactures specifications on air flow as most are measured with a bare Blower - no filters/cyclone or ducting.
Most DC's are low pressure and high flow devices and only produce around15" water negative pressure ( opposite of a Vacumn cleaner). With this amount of negative pressure the maximum airflow that can be achieved in 4" pipe is only in the region of 500CFM. With 500 CFM entering 6" or 8" trunklines the air velocity in the trunk will be below the velocity required to keep sawdust in suspension and it will settle out in the piping.
If you use 6" trunk then you must use 6" ducting to the machines or have 3 x4" ducts open at the same time.
You might like to Google Bill Pence for an excellent discussion on effective Dust Collection.
Enjoy your new workshop
Ron
 
Thanks for the input folks, William Rogers-very interesting advice, I actually put several tools on rolling cabinets (for storage and mobility) and I am planning on a drop I can rotate machines on for DC on these. Ron Boulton--I have purchase a CV Max from Clear Vue, the CFM of the unit is 1935--so I hope I'll be OK with the runs I need.
 
Don
With a CV max you dont have problems with adequate flow in an 8” pipe provided adequate air can enter the pipe. You really need two 6” inlets or 6 x 4” inlets open at all times.
I have a CV 1800 and really wished I had purchased the Max as I could have run it at slower speed to reduce the noise but still with adequate air flow
Ron
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top