Sanders

[Thom Schuck]

Ok now that we sorted out my carbide cutter issues…thank you!
what is the best style sander to use for inside of bowls or on the outside of vessels and such? I looked at WoodTurners. They have electric and then the Turner Turbo Wonder Inertia sander. Which way should I go? Electric or other?….. Thank You!
TS
Portland

 

[William Rogers]

I suggest electric. Inertia sanders are not effect at the center of the bowl as they need rpm to work. As far as brand, my Milwaukee is the best, but expensive. I also have the HF Bauer and it is good for the price. I had two of the blue sanders and both failed after about 6 months.

 

[Alan Weinberg]

Does anyone make a random orbit sander that takes small round discs—2-3 inches—that can be used on a bowl?

 

[Dave Fritz]

SX E 400 (600405420) Random Orbital Sander | Metabo Power Tools

SX E 400 (600405420) Random Orbital Sander from Metabo - High-quality, reliable and long-lasting. Learn about professional power tools from Metabo now.

www.metabo.com

 

[Gerald Lawrence]

Does anyone make a random orbit sander that takes small round discs—2-3 inches—that can be used on a bowl?

Woodturners Wonders has a pneumatic . Ken recommends the small one.
SANDERS

 

[robo hippy]

I have been using the Milwaukee and Sioux drills for many years. Now, Milwaukee makes their own drills. I did look at the inertial sanders a long time ago and while they may work, you can't stop your bowl on the lathe to work on problem spots, and the need for that is constant. I did try one of the cheap drills, and it wore out almost instantly. I think it was the trigger. Yes, it was replaceable, but I would be spending too much time running back and forth to the store to replace it. I think Grex made a small pneumatic ROS. I did find out that the pneumatic drills would keep the compressor running non stop, and figured that would up my electric bill considerably. Biggest killers of the drills, which we use more as grinders rather than drills, is running while pushing too hard, and running at full speed. I never pull the trigger more than half way. Running slower gives the abrasives more time to dig in and cut, and you don't generate any dangerous levels of heat which can cause cracks. As for the ROS types, I think they work fine for finer grits, like 220 and above, but not nearly as well as the angle drills. I pretty much never blow my drills out. They have sealed bearings, so dust should not be a problem. They are not built for what we do to and with them. I did try a cordless one once, and I would have needed several batteries to keep it running non stop.

robo hippy

 

[Doug Freeman]

I use electric. Agree with other responses on inertia type - run your drill slow and you get the same thing. Air uses way too much air. I use both a close quarters drill and an ROS. I've used 3 or 4 Neiko drills (off amazon) when they were cheaper/available. Been using an HF Bauer version for the past couple of years - a bit heavier and not as good of an angle but it works well.

3.5 Amp 3/8 in. Variable Speed Close Quarters Drill

Amazing deals on this 3.5A 3/8In Close Quarters Drill at Harbor Freight. Quality tools & low prices.

www.harborfreight.com

For an ROS I use a var speed polisher. Comes with 3" pad. I use the 2" pads from HF with extensions from McMaster-Carr to fit the threads. An extension is needed to do interiors.

Amazon.com

For material removal nothing beats a drill. Once that is done, it's a matter of removing scratches progressing through the grits, and both do pretty well. The ROS just leaves a better final finish with the last 1 or 2 grits. One thing I've learned is you want the sanding disc to extend past the edge of the pad. I don't get as deep of scratches with any grit using a larger disc (I use Vince's 2-3/8")

The next question is what size backer pad, interface pad, and discs, and from whom. That's a more endless debate than what drill or ros.

 

[Kent Reisdorph]

Does anyone make a random orbit sander that takes small round discs—2-3 inches—that can be used on a bowl?

I use this one from Amazon. It's pneumatic if it matters.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07MT7PK82

 

[Alan Weinberg]

The next question is what size backer pad, interface pad, and discs, and from whom. That's a more endless debate than what drill or ros.

Happy to hear your thoughts. I’m here to learn.

 

[Steve Chaplin]

I use a Sioux for power sanding on the lathe. Off the lathe I use the Woodturners Wonders pneumatic. The ROS is better off the lathe to minimize any scratch patterns The ROS also works great for rubbing out finish.

 

[Dennis Weiner]

If you search Amazon for a random orbital sander, you may come up short.

I found mine when I searched for a 3" electric random orbital polisher. The one I bought came with a 3" pad but I purchased 2" and 1" arbors and shaft extenders separately. It features variable speed. I bought it a few years ago and it is no longer available on Amazon. There are similar ones via the Amazon search ( 3" electric random orbital polisher ).

There is some more detail on my selection in a previous thread:

Metabo Users

Anyone who uses the Metabo RO sander do you also use an sanding pads with it? If so what do you use and where do you get them? I've used some soft ones from 3M but they're 3 inch and the sander is 3 1/8. Also curious what sanding medium you prefer.

www.aawforum.org

and illustrated

Metabo Users

Anyone who uses the Metabo RO sander do you also use an sanding pads with it? If so what do you use and where do you get them? I've used some soft ones from 3M but they're 3 inch and the sander is 3 1/8. Also curious what sanding medium you prefer.

www.aawforum.org

 

[Vincent Vogel]

I bought the small one Gerald mentioned above from Woodturners Wonders. I like it for bowls and most anything else I do that's small. It's pneumatic. If you're buying pneumatic watch the air consumption. The one I bought only uses 3cfm @ 90psi. Most of the ones I researched on Amazon, etc. use 7-9 cfm which will cause a small compressor to run constantly. My compressor cycles on and off with this sander. I usually use a battery powered drill up to 180 and the random orbit from 220 up but sometimes start and finish with the random orbit.

 

[Alan Weinberg]

I use a Sioux for power sanding on the lathe.

I’d like to hire someone also. Not sure I’d use an American Indian though.

 

[Alan Weinberg]

I found a 1 inch electric ROS on MSCDirect. And a 3 inch. Tech support will let me know if either accepts other sizes of pads. They are also calling a couple other suppliers to see if they have such an item. I’ll follow up.

 

[Roger Wiegand]

If you can afford the air this Grex pneumatic RO sander is terrific for touching up bowl interiors. You wouldn't want to use it as an 80 grit gouge for removing tear-out; it's a finish sander, not very fast. The Milwaukee/Sioux angle drills are best for that. You need a big compressor to run the Grex continuously for any period of time.

With the advances in brushless electric motor technology allowing very small powerful motors I'm surprised and disappointed that no one makes an electric sander with a form factor closer to the Grex. I'm certain that quite a few turners would be happy to pay a premium price for a tiny, maneuverable RO sander.

Arbortech makes a small RO adapter that you use with an angle grinder that can be useful in bowls, but again you're horsing around a big angle grinder to spin a little disk.

 

[Rusty Nesmith]

I have the electric one from Woodturners Wonders. They have some great kits. This is the one I bought. It works very good.

 

[Ricc Havens]

https://rikontools.com/product/model-31-122-12v-li-drill-impact-driver-combo-kit/Does anyone make a random orbit sander that takes small round discs—2-3 inches—that can be used on a bowl?

I fellow club member showed one of these at a club meeting last January. They were out of stock from Woodcraft and Rikon. But now both show it as available. I just got one to try. I know it won't be for long production sanding due to having to charge a battery. But I get tired of my corded drill getting tangled. NOTE: it's not a variable speed trigger. It has 4 speed settings. You turn it on and then tap the button to bump it up to the speed you want. Not sure what the long term life/use will be but thought I would give it a try.

RIKON 12V Li Cordless Sander/Polisher with 2" Pad | Woodcraft

Buy the 12V Li Cordless Sander/Polisher with 2" Pad for sale online from Woodcraft. Visit us to order online or find your local Woodcraft store today!

www.woodcraft.com

Model 31-200: 12V Li Cordless Sander/ Polisher with 2” Pad - Rikon Power Tools

• Spindle Lock • Soft Grip • 2” Interchangeable Hook & Loop Pads • 5 Speed LED Indicator • 12V Li Battery 12V Cordless Sander/Polisher 31-200 is the perfect tool for sanding/ polishing a multitude of projects: automotive, wood, metal and home repair. Light-weight and compact design allows easy...

rikontools.com

Note: It only comes with ONE battery. Extra batteries are $30 or so. But you can buy the Rikon 12v drill and impact driver kit with charger and two batteries for $99..https://rikontools.com/product/model-31-122-12v-li-drill-impact-driver-combo-kit/
I was lucky enough to snag one for $80 on Amazon. Don't really need the extra drill or impact driver. But it will go in my travel bucket of tools so I don't have to lug my Makita 18v around when I do little fix it jobs here and there.

 

[Alan Weinberg]

I fellow club member showed one of these at a club meeting last January. They were out of stock from Woodcraft and Rikon. But now both show it as available. I just got one to try. I know it won't be for long production sanding due to having to charge a battery. But I get tired of my corded drill getting tangled. NOTE: it's not a variable speed trigger. It has 4 speed settings. You turn it on and then tap the button to bump it up to the speed you want. Not sure what the long term life/use will be but thought I would give it a try.

RIKON 12V Li Cordless Sander/Polisher with 2" Pad | Woodcraft

Buy the 12V Li Cordless Sander/Polisher with 2" Pad for sale online from Woodcraft. Visit us to order online or find your local Woodcraft store today!

www.woodcraft.com

Model 31-200: 12V Li Cordless Sander/ Polisher with 2” Pad - Rikon Power Tools

• Spindle Lock • Soft Grip • 2” Interchangeable Hook & Loop Pads • 5 Speed LED Indicator • 12V Li Battery 12V Cordless Sander/Polisher 31-200 is the perfect tool for sanding/ polishing a multitude of projects: automotive, wood, metal and home repair. Light-weight and compact design allows easy...

rikontools.com

Note: It only comes with ONE battery. Extra batteries are $30 or so. But you can buy the Rikon 12v drill and impact driver kit with charger and two batteries for $99..https://rikontools.com/product/model-31-122-12v-li-drill-impact-driver-combo-kit/
I was lucky enough to snag one for $80 on Amazon. Don't really need the extra drill or impact driver. But it will go in my travel bucket of tools so I don't have to lug my Makita 18v around when I do little fix it jobs here and there.

those are nice but they aren’t RO sanders. I have the blue one Randy pictured but it’s also not RO. I’m hoping that if I find an electric RO sander that takes 1, 2, and 3 inch discs that it’ll help with sanding. I like the “RO” aspect at least in theory.

 

[hughie]

Does anyone make a random orbit sander that takes small round discs—2-3 inches—that can be used on a bowl?

There are a couple who do, but I thought the pricing was high for what you were getting. So I ended up making my own with a fully universal head and a couple of skateboard bearings. It has a 12" handle clad in ribbed plastic for grip with a 1/2"x 14" stainless extension built into it, 50mm or 2" sanding head with velcro pad. The 2" is the standard size and can be reduced on a grinder but with a caveat.

What I have found if you reduce the head down below 1.25" the heat build up during use can destroy the foam backing, melt the Velcro glue as it the head cant dissipate the heat.
I have sold quite lot of them to local turners and overseas. But unfortunately I am out of stock and in the middle of moving house and shop and I wont be have any stock till after Christmas at the earliest.

If you go looking for inertia sander, I have a few ideas on what to look for. Make sure as much as you can, the head is fully universal, ideally they need two sealed bearings which will give it long life. The diameter of the handle is important if you're doing deep vessels as it needs to be light weight and the extension piece can be any thickness. The locking mechanism needs to be simple and effective. I wouldnt pay to much attention to the extension dia as long its not heavy and clunky. The sander needs to be light weight for internal sander. Just as a matter of interest, I made one with a 6mm or 1/4" stainless rod worked fine,I still have it somewhere.

 

[henry dalton]

I use a Makita angle drill and have been happy with it.

 

[Michael Nathal]

For electric ROS you only have three choices, maybe 4. They are listed by others above, I am just summarizing. 1. The Metabo ROS takes ~3 inch pad. You could jury rig it to accept 2 inch disks by stacking some interface pads. Many turners use this one, but I was disappointed with the durability of this unit, especially at its $200 price tag. My $50 rotary drill has lasted many years longer than this machine, which quit on me after about 3 - 4 years. At 3 inch diameter, it is not as convenient for the inside of bowls, but it worked great for me on exteriors, where I used it at 180 grit and beyond. 2. The Arbortec device that attaches to an angle drill. It does include a little adaptor so you don't have to buy their specialty paper. I bought this but have only used it a few times. Now that my Metabo died I will try it again. 3. The "orbital polishers" mentioned by Doug Freeman. Zota is the name of the brand, they have 2 or 3 similar models, all modestly priced. I bought one, they do have a ROS type action, but it is not the same action as the Metabo, it vibrates more in your hand, and the orbit is way bigger. Definitely more like a polisher and not like any ROS that I have used. I have used it a few times and it seems to work well, except for getting into corners/sharp features on a turning. 4. I tried to find the ROS on the MSC website, but the offerings were very unclear and I have doubts if the small ones really exist. 5. I have used a battery operated "multi-tool" (those ones with the various saw blades and triangle shaped sander attachment. These are not an ROS, they just vibrate without orbiting. Nevertheless, it seems to work well.

One final note, regarding the 3M Cubitron II mesh sand paper that is winning all the rave reviews: I find them to work great on ROS but are nothing special on rotary drills.

 

[odie]

The older Sioux and Milwaukee 55° angle sanders are my preference.

-o-

 

[Dean Center]

Can someone explain what the advantage of a 55 degree angle on the sander is, over the 90 degrees of a standard or side oriented drill? Or is it the size of the tool that's the advantage?

 

[Alan Weinberg]

For electric ROS you only have three choices, maybe 4. They are listed by others above, I am just summarizing. 1. The Metabo ROS takes ~3 inch pad. You could jury rig it to accept 2 inch disks by stacking some interface pads. Many turners use this one, but I was disappointed with the durability of this unit, especially at its $200 price tag. My $50 rotary drill has lasted many years longer than this machine, which quit on me after about 3 - 4 years. At 3 inch diameter, it is not as convenient for the inside of bowls, but it worked great for me on exteriors, where I used it at 180 grit and beyond. 2. The Arbortec device that attaches to an angle drill. It does include a little adaptor so you don't have to buy their specialty paper. I bought this but have only used it a few times. Now that my Metabo died I will try it again. 3. The "orbital polishers" mentioned by Doug Freeman. Zota is the name of the brand, they have 2 or 3 similar models, all modestly priced. I bought one, they do have a ROS type action, but it is not the same action as the Metabo, it vibrates more in your hand, and the orbit is way bigger. Definitely more like a polisher and not like any ROS that I have used. I have used it a few times and it seems to work well, except for getting into corners/sharp features on a turning. 4. I tried to find the ROS on the MSC website, but the offerings were very unclear and I have doubts if the small ones really exist. 5. I have used a battery operated "multi-tool" (those ones with the various saw blades and triangle shaped sander attachment. These are not an ROS, they just vibrate without orbiting. Nevertheless, it seems to work well.

One final note, regarding the 3M Cubitron II mesh sand paper that is winning all the rave reviews: I find them to work great on ROS but are nothing special on rotary drills.

very helpful summary! Seems there’s a real woodturner need for a quality ROS that accepts small discs.

 

[hockenbery]

Can someone explain what the advantage of a 55 degree angle on the sander is, over the 90 degrees of a standard or side oriented drill? Or is it the size of the tool that's the advantage?

I use a 90degree makita. This drill body/grip will hit the rim of bowls that are higher than wide.
A drill extender can usually get the mandrel on the wood.
The advantage of the 55 degree is the same bottom of the bowl gouges.

I rarely do anything deeper than a hemispherical shape so my 90 degree works fine. I also use the Ellsworth grind and don’t need a bottom of the bowl gouge for these shapes.

 

[robo hippy]

The right angle drills are more difficult to get inside a deeper bowl than the 'angle' drills.

robo hippy

 

[Kent Jaffrey]

I tried the Woodturner Wonders angle drill and it was fine for the outside of bowls. When it died I bit the bullet and got a right angle MAkita and I love it for the outside of the bowl. I keep a 3” pad on it and it works great. For the inside of the bowls I prefer a regular plug in 3/8” drill With a 2” pad. It has better reach and control inside the bowl. I don’t like a regular drill for the outside as I find them more jumpy since the pad is so much further away from the handle the sanding pad can generate more torque and jump around more.

 

[Brian Gustin]

I just use a regular plain ol' Makita Cordless drill (I have 2) with Woodturners Wonders Roloc pads and their Green Wave sanding disks- I have the 2 inch and 1 inch sets - The green wave disks work great for inside and outside, and because of the "wing" flaps my sanding pad never needs actually touch or follow the surface itself, which is a benefit in a way , keeps from applying pressure while sanding which creates heat and burnishing, so I don't have a lot of control issues.. Works great for sanding "air" on things like natural edge bowls , and other interrupted cut turnings as well , although it does require some steady hand and very gentle application as it is easy to twitch in too close and catch the disk (or the pad or drill arbor) on a corner or edge.. so I wouldn't recommend it until you have already had lots of practice on regular bowl/turnings - Only downside to the straight drill is it can be awkward to get the sanding disk in close to the chuck or tenon, but other than that I have been quite happy with using my regular drill & WW sanding kit.

 

[Bill Blasic]

My go to sanding equipment is still DeWalt corded drills using Steve Worcester's Mirka Gold sandpaper. Tried and true for me.

 

[Dave Landers]

Lots of options and trade offs. Generally:
Powered drill is good, especially for sanding with the lathe not rotating (like wings of a natural edge piece).
Inertia sanders are less aggressive than powered, which is often good - but sometimes not. And require the wood to be spinning.
Plain hand-held paper is easy - you probably already have a pair of hands in your shop and always an option no matter what tool you buy.
Angled drills are good to get you closer to the work and thus more stable. They can often fit inside a bowl easier than a straight drill - but as noted not always all the way to the bottom of a deep bowl.
Electric drills are made for drilling, and many (especially less expensive ones) won't hold up to the length of time we run them for sanding. None of them like the dust.
Some have good luck with cheap electric drills - before I got my Milwaukee angle drill, I ran thru 2 or 3 of the cheap ones in as many years. Maybe 1 cheap drill per year is ok budget-wise (maybe less ok environment-wise).
Corded drills are nice except for the cord. Cordless drills are nice except for the batteries.
Pneumatic (air) sanders are good and specifically made for sanding, if you have a big enough compressor to run them.

Starting out, I would probably suggest:
Get one of the cheap angle drills (Neiko or whatever brand they are) and see if it does the job for you. When it dies, you will have enough experience to know what to get next.
Get a mini 90º die-grinder from harbor freight (they're less than $15). This is what I use (without air!) for my inertia sander - it's small, cheap, and the bearings are good. Know that it has a 1/4" collet, so you need a sanding mandrel with a round shaft rather than the hex ones.
Pick a good brand/line/vendor of sandpaper. Many were mentioned above and all are good. Buy plenty, use it liberally - sandpaper, like other tools, only works well when sharp, and it's a real pain to sharpen