I saw a picture of a metal rimmed bowl on another site and started thinking about how to incorporate it into my turnings. My main question is about tools. I've seen how to spin metal over a form but don't know exactly what to use to cut the edge when done. Can anyone give me an idea of the type steel to use and proper angle for sharpening. I have several ideas for things but want to do this safely!!!
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Metal turning (copper, aluminum)
- Thread starter Bryant
- Start date
I incorporated 2" copper pipe as banding around a gavel head. (If I figure how to post pictures I will. There's a small photo on page 3, top right corner, of the club newsletter seen here: http://www.ovwg.org/New-OVWG-Site/Newsletters/2008-02NL.pdf
I did the final turning to true up the pipe and adjacent wood surfaces using nothing but a spindle roughing gouge. It had about a 40-45 degree bevel (I've never measured it), same as used in wood turning. I made sure it was sharp.
The technique was just rock solid turning techniques. Tool on the tool rest. Back of the gouge lowered until contact with the metal surface. Continue lowering gouge keeping the back of the tool, and then the bevel, on the copper surface. As soon as threads of copper started shaving, the angle was right and then it was just a matter of working very slowly across the face of the pipe and wood.
The copper "shavings" looked more like a steel wool pad made of copper.
It took about an hour and I sharpened the tool about every ten minutes, but it worked very well.
I did the final turning to true up the pipe and adjacent wood surfaces using nothing but a spindle roughing gouge. It had about a 40-45 degree bevel (I've never measured it), same as used in wood turning. I made sure it was sharp.
The technique was just rock solid turning techniques. Tool on the tool rest. Back of the gouge lowered until contact with the metal surface. Continue lowering gouge keeping the back of the tool, and then the bevel, on the copper surface. As soon as threads of copper started shaving, the angle was right and then it was just a matter of working very slowly across the face of the pipe and wood.
The copper "shavings" looked more like a steel wool pad made of copper.
It took about an hour and I sharpened the tool about every ten minutes, but it worked very well.
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- May 13, 2007
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- 3
Hi c12mech,
First off,
Trimming is dangerous!
The trimming tool I use when spinning is a piece of 3/8 square HSS, driven into the end of a length of 3/8 iron pipe. The cutter starts about 3" long and is driven into the pipe about an inch.
To drive the HSS into the pipe, the end entering the pipe is ground square, and a lead is ground onto the corners of the cutter to allow for starting, and as the piece continues into the pipe, creates a wedge effect, making the cutter very tight in the pipe. The end that will be used in cutting is also ground square prior to driving into the pipe, to allow for a solid blow to be applied. I use a brass hammer for driving, and do wear safety glasses. Set the end of the pipe opposite the cutter on a solid surface to do the driving in.
The pipe is then fit into a wooden handle about 16" to 18" long, and the total length of cutter, pipe, and handle is about 28 to 30 inches long. The length of the trimming tool helps stablize things when in use.
As for the business end of the cutter, hope the following helps.
Facing the end opposite the handle: With the square body of the cutter top horizontal, sides vertical, the last 1/4" or so is ground to give a 5 degree slope across the top with the right side high, and is also ground to give a 5 degree undercut top to bottom, starting at the right top corner. This leaves an acute (approx 80 degree) corner at the top right side.
Now, facing the trim tool from the side with the shaft horizontal, with the cutter towards the right, and the acute corner in the 12 o'clock position, the end of the cutter will be ground to give a 5 to10 degree undercut from the acute corner towards the opposite corner.
In use, a spinning tool rest is used that has a fulcrim pin, and the shaft of the tool is kept horizontal and fairly square to the part to be trimmed, held against the pin and held against your hip. The tip of the tool is swung into the part to be trimmed using the motion of your body for control. Keeping the tool rest close helps with control also. The square of the original HSS is pretty much in a horizontal top, vertical sides orientation, giving the ground portion a 5 degree positive rake on top, and about a 5 degree clearance under the tip.
Trimming is usually done whenever the part is excessively out of round, and just prior to laying the final portion of the blank onto the form.
Trimming leaves a burr that needs to be removed, and often times the trimming tool can be used for this purpose. Files and commecial deburring tools are also effective.
And finally,
Trimming is dangerous!
Later,
Dale M
p.s. If you plan on doing some spinning, I suggest you obtain a copy of Terry Tynan's first set of DVD's from(metalspinningworkshop.com). Trimming, as well as the fundamentals of the process are very well explained.
First off,
Trimming is dangerous!
The trimming tool I use when spinning is a piece of 3/8 square HSS, driven into the end of a length of 3/8 iron pipe. The cutter starts about 3" long and is driven into the pipe about an inch.
To drive the HSS into the pipe, the end entering the pipe is ground square, and a lead is ground onto the corners of the cutter to allow for starting, and as the piece continues into the pipe, creates a wedge effect, making the cutter very tight in the pipe. The end that will be used in cutting is also ground square prior to driving into the pipe, to allow for a solid blow to be applied. I use a brass hammer for driving, and do wear safety glasses. Set the end of the pipe opposite the cutter on a solid surface to do the driving in.
The pipe is then fit into a wooden handle about 16" to 18" long, and the total length of cutter, pipe, and handle is about 28 to 30 inches long. The length of the trimming tool helps stablize things when in use.
As for the business end of the cutter, hope the following helps.
Facing the end opposite the handle: With the square body of the cutter top horizontal, sides vertical, the last 1/4" or so is ground to give a 5 degree slope across the top with the right side high, and is also ground to give a 5 degree undercut top to bottom, starting at the right top corner. This leaves an acute (approx 80 degree) corner at the top right side.
Now, facing the trim tool from the side with the shaft horizontal, with the cutter towards the right, and the acute corner in the 12 o'clock position, the end of the cutter will be ground to give a 5 to10 degree undercut from the acute corner towards the opposite corner.
In use, a spinning tool rest is used that has a fulcrim pin, and the shaft of the tool is kept horizontal and fairly square to the part to be trimmed, held against the pin and held against your hip. The tip of the tool is swung into the part to be trimmed using the motion of your body for control. Keeping the tool rest close helps with control also. The square of the original HSS is pretty much in a horizontal top, vertical sides orientation, giving the ground portion a 5 degree positive rake on top, and about a 5 degree clearance under the tip.
Trimming is usually done whenever the part is excessively out of round, and just prior to laying the final portion of the blank onto the form.
Trimming leaves a burr that needs to be removed, and often times the trimming tool can be used for this purpose. Files and commecial deburring tools are also effective.
And finally,
Trimming is dangerous!
Later,
Dale M
p.s. If you plan on doing some spinning, I suggest you obtain a copy of Terry Tynan's first set of DVD's from(metalspinningworkshop.com). Trimming, as well as the fundamentals of the process are very well explained.
Last edited:
Steve Worcester
Admin Emeritus
In addition to the www.metalspinningworkshop.com website, Oneway has a few tidbits on thier site
http://www.oneway.ca/metal_spinning/index.htm
http://www.oneway.ca/metal_spinning/index.htm
Spinning
I'm glad to see the subject come up here.
I have been incorporating metal features into my turnings for about a year now. Here are some thoughts based on a year+ of trial and error. I am by no means accomplished but if I am happy to pass on my experience and research to anyone that wants it. This is nearly a lost craft!
Resources:
I agree, get Terrys videos. He also sells tools but I made my own, from his videos. They are pretty straight forward to make from W2 steel.
He sells materials and there is a spinning forum, the right Al makes a big difference. I haven't found a direct source that I like.
Your lathe:
I have converted my Jet to a metal spinning lathe. Even repainted it
Wood lathes can be converted but I found that the characteristics of wood and metal turning to be different enough to dedicate a lathe.
Mainly the metal lathe needs to be lower to get the right leverage. I removed the feet, and stand on a platform.
The centers need to be dead on, otherwise it is difficult for an un-spun disk to stay on center.
You sling the lubricant so put it in a place that that is acceptable. Grease and wood turned pieces aren't compatible Unless you are planning to come up with a GREASE finish.
You will need a tap the size and thread of your spindle to make your mandrels. Mandrels take some work to get surfaces that do not imprint into the spun piece.
Tools;
Not many sources. Terry or make your own. I have seem some on Ebay but they are not beefy enough for me. Don't be fooled by the ones made by woodturning vendors. There is a lot of force used to form metal! You will need a tool rest (trest), I made mine with shop tools and plans are on my site in the store.
I followed Terrys instructions for my trim tool but I noticed that many are now using a hardened bit inserted in a bar similar to a hollowing tool. Thats a better way to go.
You may need a way to cut circles. I use an electric sheer that I bought from HF. The best way is to buy Terry's circles and spend you time spinning rather than cutting. You sometimes can get a used circle cutter but they are a bit to expensive for me considering this is a sideline.
Learning:
I find this craft interesting but also challenging, don't be afraid to spin scrap metal for months before you get your first piece that you are brave enough to show anyone. Buy a stack of disks to start.
SPINNING IS VERY DANGEROUS:
This is no joke, a disk of Al spinning at 1000RPM is likened to a table saw blade with no guard and no control. Terry's DVD's provide some good safety instruction as well.
My first real project was a coffee cup. Right now I am working on a holy water font for a client, that used a spun bowl-like design for holding the water.
http://www.turnedoutright.com/search/coffee+cup
http://www.turnedoutright.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/aug-07-066-small.jpg
Hope this is helpful I'd love to keep the discussion going.
I'm glad to see the subject come up here.
I have been incorporating metal features into my turnings for about a year now. Here are some thoughts based on a year+ of trial and error. I am by no means accomplished but if I am happy to pass on my experience and research to anyone that wants it. This is nearly a lost craft!
Resources:
I agree, get Terrys videos. He also sells tools but I made my own, from his videos. They are pretty straight forward to make from W2 steel.
He sells materials and there is a spinning forum, the right Al makes a big difference. I haven't found a direct source that I like.
Your lathe:
I have converted my Jet to a metal spinning lathe. Even repainted it
Wood lathes can be converted but I found that the characteristics of wood and metal turning to be different enough to dedicate a lathe.
Mainly the metal lathe needs to be lower to get the right leverage. I removed the feet, and stand on a platform.
The centers need to be dead on, otherwise it is difficult for an un-spun disk to stay on center.
You sling the lubricant so put it in a place that that is acceptable. Grease and wood turned pieces aren't compatible
Unless you are planning to come up with a GREASE finish.You will need a tap the size and thread of your spindle to make your mandrels. Mandrels take some work to get surfaces that do not imprint into the spun piece.
Tools;
Not many sources. Terry or make your own. I have seem some on Ebay but they are not beefy enough for me. Don't be fooled by the ones made by woodturning vendors. There is a lot of force used to form metal! You will need a tool rest (trest), I made mine with shop tools and plans are on my site in the store.
I followed Terrys instructions for my trim tool but I noticed that many are now using a hardened bit inserted in a bar similar to a hollowing tool. Thats a better way to go.
You may need a way to cut circles. I use an electric sheer that I bought from HF. The best way is to buy Terry's circles and spend you time spinning rather than cutting. You sometimes can get a used circle cutter but they are a bit to expensive for me considering this is a sideline.
Learning:
I find this craft interesting but also challenging, don't be afraid to spin scrap metal for months before you get your first piece that you are brave enough to show anyone. Buy a stack of disks to start.
SPINNING IS VERY DANGEROUS:
This is no joke, a disk of Al spinning at 1000RPM is likened to a table saw blade with no guard and no control. Terry's DVD's provide some good safety instruction as well.
My first real project was a coffee cup. Right now I am working on a holy water font for a client, that used a spun bowl-like design for holding the water.
http://www.turnedoutright.com/search/coffee+cup
http://www.turnedoutright.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/08/aug-07-066-small.jpg
Hope this is helpful I'd love to keep the discussion going.