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Hunter Carbide Tools

I found that using a diamond file on these cutters will prolong their life, although the manufacturer does not recommend it.


"Hunter circular carbide cutters last up to 100 times longer than similar HSS cutters and does not require sharpening. When the cutting edge is dull, simply rotate the cutter to position a fresh cutting edge and you’re ready to go. When worn out, throw the old cutter away and install a new one."

At $23-25 for a replacement, these cutters are expensive. Depending upon the wood being cut, re-sharpening will help save you some money.
 
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I don't think he means rub the bevel to sharpen, I believe he means rub the bevel while cutting.
No, I don't believe you rub the bevel with these tools, but I have not used them to be certain.
 
cwearing

The general rule I use for scrapers is to not let the bevel touch the wood.
With most scrapers when the bevel touches wood the wood drives onto the tool and the tool cannot escape - big catch

For a scraper held flat on the tool rest and level to the floor the tool rest is used below center on the outside of the bowl and above center on the inside.

Holding a scraper at 45 degrees with the bevel 120 degrees to the surface of the wood often gives the cleanest surface and no chance of a catch.

I have hunter tips on a set of Bosch hollowing tools. I have used the straight tool on the inside of boxes and goblets with no handle and it works great held at about 45 / 120 degrees. It also works well for for hollowing too.

since the carbide is screwed to a rod, I don't think the bevel on my tools can contact the wood. If the mounting rod contacts the wood the tool will get a bit grabby and may catch.

Happy Turning
Al
 
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Actually using the bevel is the best way to use the tool. See the video below. Since the tool has a slight angle to the outside, this functions as a bevel and gives you lots of control. You can of course use is as a scraper by tilting the tool to about 45 degrees or so and using the bottom lip. I show this at the end of the bowl segment.
I find this really tool really useful for some things especially woods that don't cut clean. Increase the speed of the lathe and take a light cut, rub the bevel and it cuts clean.
I just talked to Mike Hunter this weekend and you can't sharpen them even with a diamond. He says they are made of Nano carbide and the hardness is right below diamond.
I don't think 23 dollars is unreasonable considering that the cutters last for a year or more. I've been using mine a lot and have only rotated the cutter one time.
I don't normally recommend using the tool flat since this will lead to a pretty big catch. Tilt it to the side. However, Jimmy Clewes was using a #1 cutter in a Rolly Monroe tool to demonstrate this weekend. The tool is held flat but the stop that fits on top of the cutter on the Monroe system acts like a bevel and limits the cut. It cuts really fast in this position and won't get a catch.
http://www.youtube.com/user/john59lucas
 
Here are 3 of the #1 hunter tools. One is designed for the Lyle Jamieson style bars and the cutter is mounted at a slight angle. This is generally a scraping tool but leaves a pretty clean cut.
The second one is a #1 cutter in a 1/4" flat bar. I use this in a homemade John Jordan style tool. I tilt the cutter to the left when cutting.
The bottom cutter is a 3/16" round bar and fits in the new John Jordan tools. You can mount this one at any angle but about 45 degrees to the left is best. If you use it flat in the curved John Jordan bars it's pretty hard to control. Tilted it works fantastic.
The one in the Lyle Jamieson bar I've use extensively and maybe rotated it once. I don't think I've rotated it more than that. I remember I thought it might be getting dull so I rotated it but the cut's didn't improve. That was a nasty piece of wood. I used it later on a decent wood and it still cuts just fine.
 
John,
That is a nice video.

It looks a little like using a micro bevel on a gouge.

Have you tried that on a goblet or box?
It might cut rim to the bottom of a goblet cup if the tool shaft clears the rim.
A small gouge will with the micro bevel.
Seems like the hunter tool would if the bevel is supporting the cut.
I wonder about making the turn across the end grain and having the tool want to back up.

I have the number 1 on the bottom in straight and bent Bosch hollowing tool.
Haven't used them too much yet.
Al
 
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All On small boxes and goblets that are endgrain the cut is bevel rubbing across the bottom but turns into a sort of shear scrape as you come out toward the lip (depending on the shape but I'm assuming more or less straight sides). It also depends on which cutter and which bar. He sells curved bars and this changes the way they cut.
It cuts very similar to ring tools and hook tools so if you know how to rub the bevel on them you get exactly the same cut. I have mounted one #1 cutter in the 3/16 square bar in a lyle Jamieson style rotating head. This allows me to put the bar at 45 or 90 degrees so I can rub the bevel on the side cuts.
I think we have just stared to discover what can be done with these tools.
 
John Lucas has done an excellent job with his input and his youtube video is one of my favorites. The Hunter tools are very versatile and some of my favorite tools. The common mistake is using them flat horizontally. As John mentioned this will result in a catch. The exceptions to this rule would be the Munro system or a system or shaft that would tilt the cutter enough to put the edge in a negative rake configuration. Just as with the hook tools and other style of tools the edge should be at an angle whether it's scraping or cutting. The degree can be easily adjusted by a slight "roll" of your wrist to a regular scrape to a shearing scrape. For bevel supported cuts, I do use John's techniques from the video about using the bevel first then by changing my angle start the "cut". To teach I like to use Barry Gross' "ABC's". Anchor the tool, by setting it on the tool rest; rub/touch the Bevel of the tool on the wood, then lift or tilt the handle to make the Cut.

The cutters last a very long time. They are so incrediblly sharp and versatile. By using the Hunter on several applications the surface is so well done I can start sanding with much higher grits. When sanding discs are $13 to $15 for a pack of 50 of 3" discs- being able to not to use a grit or even two is nice and saves a lot of cost. I'll make more than 50 bowls a year easily. Less sanding time, and using less sanding paper over a year's time is worth a lot more than a $20 cutter.


Just my opinions...

Greg H.
 
Hunter cutters

What mounting screws are you using when you use the Hunter cutters on thee homemade holders?
 
You have to use the screws he sells or if you buy the cutters somewhere else you need the screws that are made for the cutters. The inside of the cutter is tapered and the screw shank needs to match or you can split the carbide cutter. The screws are metric and quite small so your tapping and drilling skills need to be pretty good.
 
John,

You mention using the Hunter #1 cutters in the Munro Hollower. Assuming that your purchase included the torx screw that comes with the cutter, was it necessary to re-cut the threads on the Munro Hollower? If so, what size are they?
 
It was Mike Mahoney that used the Rolly Monroe. He did mention that the older Monroe bars had different sized threads. I'm not 100 percent sure he said the new ones would fit. The Hunter tools do take a very specific tapered nut to fit the tapered hole in the cutter. The thread sizes are metric and I have the sizes somewhere, just not here at work. I would e-mail Mike Hunter and ask him. He was at the same demo where Mike used the tool.
 
Bevel support with carbide cutters

I think John L. has the right idea and clearly stated. The carbide cutter is a complex tool to understand and has a learning curve unlike the HSS tools in the supported system. There are three different cuts available as you learn to use it. Bevel supported cut, shearing/ slicing cut, and negative rake scraping cut all happen in that little 3/16 round cutter. The bevel supported cut leaves the amazing surface left behind that everybody is talking about. The control you get from the line the bevel supported cut takes is unbelievable. Especially when you want to do a vessel that has a large opening, like lidded boxes, and you can see inside the vessel, this cut will let you start sanding with 320-400 grit sandpaper. It’s almost "go across the bottom and up the side and put finish on it". And that is not an exaggeration.

I did a detailed article about the intricacies of the carbide cutter in Woodturning Design Magazine, winter 2009. One thing I did not emphasize in the article is the use tip of get the bevel support FIRST. Yes, the A,B,Cs are necessary big time. People are using many boring bars for the carbide assembly but I think the swiveling tip holder is almost mandatory to take advantage of the bevel support cutting in hollow forms that have smaller openings. You need to be able to swing the handle to get the bevel in the correct position to help you. Carbide cutters are great but with the bevel supported cut they are unbelievable. If you want to see the WT Design article, it is on my web site www.lylejamieson.com. Go to Instruction menu and see published articles.
Lyle Jamieson
 
Thank you Lyle

I recently purchased a Jamieson system from Craft Supplies along with the Hunter carbide tip. I wish your Woodturning Design article had come with the tool. I wasted a lot of time and concluded that it vibrated way to much to be useful.

Now I understand what I was doing wrong.

Thank you.
 
why not

I
found that using a diamond file on these cutters will prolong their life, although the manufacturer does not recommend it.
Click to expand...


Well I guess Mark if all of us who buy Hunter tools throw them away when blunt and buy another one............. then 🙂

But as you have found you can extend the life by using your diamond file. My view if its blunt then why not have ago at sharpening as its a throw away item when blunt anyway. We have nothing to lose by trying.
 
Hunter cutters are not expensive= to the work done

My wife hollowed fifty end-grain, red maple, bell Christmas ornaments before we rotated the cutter for the first time! Fifty bells X $20 income X 8 rotations/cutter = $8K. Not to bad for a $23 cutter. I wish I could get that kind of investment in my IRA!!!
 
I use Hunter tools extensively while turning boxes. They are not my primary hollowing tool but serve as finish cutting tools. I remove the bulk of the wood quickly with a gouge and then clean up and finish shaping with the Hunter. You can hollow from start to finish with a Hunter if you so desire but it is much faster to rough out the inside with a gouge and clean up the interior with the Hunter. I have found that higher RPMs give better surfaces when using the Hunter tools. Like any other tool the quality of the finish you get with it is dependent on how well you control the tool and the speed at which you move the cutter in relationship to the wood.

As Lyle mentioned you can start in the center of the bottom of a box and cut from right to left and come straight up the side. Done slowly and deliberately on dense hardwoods the surface will almost shine. Of course you will not have a square inside corner if that is your aim but the small radius left in the corner makes it easier to sand.

I love using the Hunter swan neck tools for my undercut boxes. I remove as much wood as I can with a gouge and then start with the swan neck. I have learned that it is necessary to cut from the smallest diameter to the largest diameter both along the bottom and from the rim of the box. Again slow and deliberate is the key to a smooth finish with no tearout on the end grain.

By far they are the best tools for cutting cleanly dense exotics such as cocobolo, tulipwood, blackwood, verawood, lignum vitae, kingwood etc. The surface will nearly be a mirror with the Hunter tool thus saving a lot of time sanding and reducing the chance of heat checks. Sometimes on cocobolo etc. I have been satisfied with the finish from the cut and didn't find it necessary to sand.

Using the Hunters as finishing tool can make them last a long, long, long time.
 
I do as Mike does. I hollow the box with either spindle gouge or bowl gouge and then make the final pass at a higher speed using the hunter. On hardwoods it almost burnishes the cut.
Do you know how hard it is to get rid of the center nub on hollow vessels. It's super easy with the Hunter tool. Just cut the opposite direction. I move a little to the left of the nub and find the bevel of the tool. Then just cut from left to right. You can flatten the bottom of a box or even a very deep hollow vessel if you have the right shaft attached to the tool.
This is possible because of the very steep bevel on the tool. It is about 7 degrees off square so you can reach in through a fairly small hole and still rub the bevel. I'll make a cut across the center of the bottom (stopping at the center of course or the wood can lift the tool) Then I'll reverse the tool and cut in the normal position to finish cleaning up the inside.
 
I probably misled you a little on the bevel rubbing. when I do boxes I start with a bevel rubbing cut. As you proceed from the bottom up the side it turns into a scraping cut. You can hear the difference in the cut. Make the side cuts very light. Because of the sharp angle of the Hunter cutter it's like cutting with a skew on it's side.
To cut with the bevel rubbing on the side you need the #1 cutter mounted ideally in a Jamieson swiveling head. This allows you to rotate the cutter to best rub the bevel. You can mount the cutter in a solid bar but then you have to swivel the bar to rub the bevel and you lose a lot of versatility or simply can't get it in the proper rotation to rub the bevel.
 
I'm so glad cwearing started this thread and special thanks to Mike and John for clearing up a lot of misconceptions I had about this tool. I have one and have been very frustrated using it, which means it hasn't been used much. John's video really changed the way I'll be using this in the future and that will start today. Hopefully I can start to master the little nuiances this tool has and take advantage of it's ability to make nice clean final cuts. Everybody likes that! 😀
Don L.
 
Nice thread...........I learned alot in this reading and will hopefully start using this cutter more now............thanks to all who contributed.....
 
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