Hand Sanding With The Grain ? ?

[William Young]

I was told to skip my method by one person here a couple weeks ago when I mentioned that I was sanding with the grain with the bowl stopped between sanding with it spinning. But that is the way I learned to do it on all my pens from a DVD I have on making pens and it just makes sense for me to do it that way. . Is it only me ? . I figured the same would apply for bowls or anything else.

Then reading another forum I found the same thing as I have read on many other forums at different times and I found yet another response on a turning forum recently that said

Between sandpaper grit changes, Stop and hand sand With the grain of the wood, Lathe sanding violates the basic principle of sanding (Always sand with the grain) as the wood is turning in circles. Sanding with the grain removes the cross scratches before moving to finer paper and smaller scratches.

So I am curious to know what the majority thinks as to whether stopping and hand standing with the grain between grits actually violates the method of sanding or is it just up to the individual the way he/she wants to do it. I will continue sanding both directions and with the grain between going across grain regardless because it does a better job for me and I usually end up with a finish that just needs to be waxed and polished and shows no trace of sanding scratches . .
W.Y.

 

[waltc]

What works?

Bill,

I'm pretty new at turning, and still learning things the hard way, and read a lot of internet postings. I have discovered that there isn't ONE WAY but lots of different ways that work for different folks. So I take all postings with grain of salt, and try what looks good to see what I think. Soon I will be an expert too! <gr>

As far as sanding, I sand with the lathe spinning, then hand sand with it stopped. Direction of hand sanding is whatever is needed to smooth the wood. I find that after hand sanding, sanding with the next higher grit doesn't take long. It makes sense to me that it is harder to remove parallel scratches from 150 grit, by making more parallel scratches with 220 grit, than it is to sand across the 150 grit scratches with 150 grit before I move on to 220. I also find that I make a detailled inspection of the surface with sandpaper in my hand and can deal with small problem areas before I move up to the next grit.

That's my $.02.

Walt C

 

[William Young]

Thanks Walt;
Looks like your $.02 worth is pretty close to my 2 ¢ worth even if our cents are displayed a little differently. 😀
W.Y.

 

[Bill Boehme]

My one cent

I will give my one cent to bring the grand total up to a nickel. Whatever works for you is the right thing to do! When I started turning, an instructor told me that he was showing me the "right" way to turn a bowl. Later, others have said that a different way was the "right" way. So which is correct? I don't think that the Bowl Turning Police will ticket you for not following one person's rules. However, I do respect and follow the "safety rules" which are the closest thing to real rules of wood turning.

Bill

 

[jimr]

I agree with you William

It makes sense to me that sanding with the grain is the "right" way. On bowls that is not possible with the lathe on. I also do a little hand sanding with the lathe off and with the grain. It certainly works with pens, of course it is much easier to go with the grain on a pen than a bowl plus it is smaller. Another thing I used to do is reverse the lathe motor direction when sanding bowls. In my experience that really helped the sanding process. But my new lathe will not reverse and I really miss that feature. I never had any problem with the faceplate unscrewing.
Anyway, I agree with you and when I saw the effect when I started making pens I try to apply it to bowls.

 

[Steve Worcester]

Personally, I power sand with the bowl spinning and then with the lathe off, I take the sanding disk off the pad and hand sand in a tight swirling motion. It helps to randomize the scratch pattern. The only time I pay attention to the grain direction is if there is a scratch across the grain that requires special attention.

 

[Mike Schwing]

I am a self admitted fanatic about sanding. Sanding scratches drive me INSANE, and I also think they're a mark of a less competent craftsman.

Because of this I have tried every thing under the sun to avoid their appearance in my finished work, and have largely been successful recently.

I find that if I am power sanding, going over each grit by hand in the grain direction is a waste of time, as the following grit negates all of that work.

If I want a truly fine surface I find the following required. (assuming one wishes to power sand)

1. Fresh sandpaper. The best adage I have heard about sandpaper is to use it as if someone else were paying for it.
2. Power sand starting at the lowest acceptable grit. Typically, even though I can create a blemish/tear out free surface, starting at 80 grit will give the entire project a clean, even scratch distribution from which to work further.
Power sanding is most effective at scratch removal when the lathe speed is very low, like 30 rpms, and sander speed very, very high.
3. Stop the lathe. Lock the spindle. Go over the surface quickly with the same grit.
4. Wipe the surface off to remove any grit particles.
5. Turn the lathe back on and do the same with each successive grit.
After 320 grit, you should have a very nice surface with no visible scratch marks. From here I continue with micro mesh sanding with the grain for each successive grit until I am satisfied. Sanding with the grain brings out the detail in the wood that sanding cross grain or in circles will not.

In my opinion, there is no way sanding cross grain will present as fine a finish as with the grain. It is all in the matter of how far one is willing to go.

Occasionally I will sand a piece entirely by hand, but I find it is nearly impossible to maintain a perfect, blemish free profile on the interior of a bowl by sanding only with the grain.

 

[William Young]

Thanks everyone for all the replys and it seems that I am on the right track in my method of sanding turned articles and I am doing what the majority does. .

Mike Schwing... thanks for the detailed explanation of the way you do it because from what I see from the many pictures you post on the 'other' site and the quality of your work, you are certainly a pro who knows what he is talking about. Your work (as well as many others) is a real inspiration for me or anyone else that have been turning for only a short while. Can always count on the ones with experience to get the right answers.
W.Y.

 

[George Van Beynen]

Mike- Sanding question

Hi Mike, I too can recognize your bowls and appreciate your finished products.

Is micromesh 320 & UP better than sandpaper? I have never used micromesh. I still have a meter of 400 & 600 from Industrial Abrasives.

Do you use every grit of micromesh?

What do you do for a green turned thin bowl?

 

[Mike Schwing]

Thanks for the compliment George. Better than sandpaper? Well, it is sandpaper! The 1500 grit micro mesh is supposedly equivalent to about 400 grit aluminum oxide. That is why I stop with power sanding at 320.

Do I skip grits? Never.

I don't do thin turned green bowls so I really can't suggest anything to you, other than hand sanding. They're not really my thing.

 

[George Van Beynen]

Mike - One more micro mesh question?

Thanks Mike, sorry for the trouble but if 1500 micro mesh is equivelent to 400 grit aluminum oxide,what is the advantage of micromesh?

I ask these questions because as you probably know I am new to turning. For the past year I have been practicing tool control and turning form while roughing blanks. Well I now have over 200, many have stopped loosing weight and it's time to start returning and finishing. I asked about green bowl finishing as once in a while it would be nice for instant gratification. A lot of your comments through the last year have saved me a lot of losses through the drying process, I am very satisfied with the results. UPS just arrived yesterday with another 5 gal pail of Anchorseal!

 

[Fred in NC]

Micromesh

All you wanted to know about Micromesh and more:

http://www.ss-sci.com/micromesh.htm

There is even a table of grit equivalents.

 

[Mike Schwing]

George, as you probably know by now via the link provided above, Micro Mesh is sandpaper. It has a cushioned backing, making it slightly unique compared to paper backed sandpapers. It also is made in very fine grits, in fact it is used to polish optical surfaces. The woodworker's kit is the one I purchase, and it has grits ranging from 1500 to 12,000. Micro mesh also lasts longer than all of the other paper backed abrasives I have used, so I start using at the first grit I can reasonably consider "polishing", which is anything above 320. If Micro Mesh came in 80 grit, I'd probably use that too!

One word of caution - Micro Mesh can burn/melt very easily. Keep the paper moving at all times, and never allow it to linger for even the shortest moment on a corner. It will melt and produce a black line on your work. The higher grit mesh seems to melt easier than the lower.

 

[George Van Beynen]

Thanks Fred and Mike,

I will order Micro Mesh this week. I'm sure it will improve my finnished product!