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Grain direction?

Dudley

Dudley

Joined
Dec 10, 2005
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I've been working with some green wood I cut up yesterday. I'm pretty sure it's hickory. Since this is my first experience with green wood, I must say that I love it! The tools seem to glide on the stuff!

Anyway, I was looking at the stack of logs in my garage and started to wonder how one turns a vessel? Do you turn cross grain like you do with bowls, or do you hollow out the end grain? And how do you dry it once it is rough turned?

Thanks,
 
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Most vessels are turned end grain not all but most.
I use the DNA alcohol method to dry my HF and bowls.
 
You can go at the grain from any orientation, depending on what you're looking for in a finished product. Just remember, always cut downhill to the grain direction. When a piece is mounted lenghtwise on a lathe, this would mean cutting downward towards the axis when cutting on the outside and upward towards the outer diameter when cutting inside a bowl. Side mounted, just the opposite.

This holds when you're working inside the vessel too.

When turning end grain on a vase, go ahead and turn it to finished thickness while green. Make sure that this is a very even thickness, especially if the vase contains the pith of the tree. This will decrease the likelyhood of cracking, although there's still a real chance because of that pith.

With side grain vases, turn to the standard 10% of thickness, wax the outside, and let dry. You'll lose a fair number to cracking (the pith again) but less so if the thickness is very consistant.

The other option on side grain is to turn to finish and let the piece deform. You get some cool results.

Dietrich
 
Ok, let me make sure I undersand.

Turning end grain would mean placing a log between centers and cutting the "bark" side of the log. (I know you should remove the bark before placing the log on the lathe for safety reasons.) The inds would be at the drive cener and tailstock.

Turning side grain would be ripping the log and having the end grain facing away from the centers. The bark side would be facing the tail stock.

Is this correct?
 
You have it right on turning end grain, but for side grain, you could put the bark side of the wood either way -- towards the tailstock or towards the headstock. Usually the bowl has more figure if the bottom of the bowl is closest to the center of the log, but not necessarily and there is no "rule". You could even have it sideways so that one side of the rim Is near the center of the log and the other is near the bark side, but then it could be an end grain turning, depending upon which way the bowl opening is facing -- in other words, an end grain turning does not need to include the center of the log -- it can be off to one side of center so that it does not include the pith.

Bill
 
As far as the orientation, I think you have it right. But more properly, an end grain turning would refer to actually cutting end grain. For example a hollow vessel with the grain running top to bottom was cut, oriented the way you mention, but the tailstock would have to be removed to cut the "hollow".

I would call a piece placed between centers a "spindle" turning rather than an end grain turning...

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but that's the way it seems to me...
 
Underdog,

Yes, spindle turning is what I was refering to. I was trying to grasp the concept of end grain vs. side grain. In most of the bowl turning videos and books, they show a ripped log mounted between centers--with the bark side towards the tailstock. I was wondering how most vessels are turned and started to get confused as how the wood is mounted.

If I have my bearings straight--most vessels are turned in a spindle position, then the tailstock is removed for hollowing. Whereas, most bowls are turned side grain then flipped to hollow.

Another drying question: if I turn a green log into a vase shape then hollow out a small section (like a weed pot)... how should I dry it?
 
Brad,

I think that I understand your question better now. Just to be technical, a bowl is also a vessel -- basically, anything that could hold water (if any extraneous holes were plugged) could be called a vessel. But, most of us use the term vessel when something is clearly not a bowl. Sometimes, it is hard to tell where the dividing line is drawn between bowls and vessels. Bowls, plates (actually a shallow bowl), vases (a tall bowl), and other kinds of hollow forms can be turned end grain or side grain. The shape of an object usually will suggest which orientation is best, but not always. A plate is almost always side grain. A tall vase is almost always end grain. Sometimes, you can't define grain direction -- such as turning a burl.

Bill
 
Frank Bowers did a bowl turning demonstration for us a couple of months ago. In his demonstration he showed us how to take a raw log to a finished bowl/s.

He took one half of it and made a natural edge bowl (bark toward the headstock), and then the other half and made a conventional bowl (bark toward the tailstock). This assumes that you turn the bottom of the bowl first, then reverse it to fit the spigot or tenon in your chuck. Of course the orientation depends on the method you use to turn bowls.

What we noted was that you get a lot more out of the log making a conventional bowl.
 
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