Finials

[Peter Hawkins]

Advice needed on if finials once finished, should they be attached permanently to the form, or should they be made to just pop in and out, going to do my first one and a bit stuck as to what to do with it ..... fix or not.
May seem like an obvious answer to a lot of you, but i'm just learning , so advice greatly appreciated,

Happy New Year everyone

regards Peter Hawkins

 

[Charlie Knighton]

only advise i can give, wood moves, different woods move differently, the only couple i have made fit loosely when first turned, they are tight now

 

[Russ Fairfield]

Can't win. Leave them loose and they get lost, glue them in and they break.

 

[MichaelMouse]

Finial, as in decorative addition to the top? Glue.

As in a decorative opener/closer top? Make a tapered hole and a tapered tenon below a bead. Nobody knows or cares how much reveal is below the bead, and the taper, with a twist, is always tight.

 

[hockenbery]

peter,

Its your piece.
Do it the way you want for reasons that make sense to you.

woodturning is full of decisions and trade offs.

if you want to get inside the the answer is obvious.

a removable finial is easier to transport and ship.

a removable may be dropped by someone who turns the piece over to look at the bottom.

happy turning,
Al

 

[Charlie Knighton]

define finial

base and finial

or just the part sticking up

 

[Peter Hawkins]

Thank you everyone for your advice, it seemed logical to go with one that sort of pops in and out, thought about the sticking with glue , but if the finial should break and its glued in then your stumped, if it can pop in and out with minor force then you can always replace when lost or broken,
Guess I'll go with one that pops in and out.

for Charlie, its the fine piece which will stick up from a hollow vessel top..

Thanks again,everyone, regards peter

 

[john lucas]

I glue mine in. If they do get broken ( so far I'm the only one who's done that to my pieces) you just carve them away. Drill out the tenon and put a new on on. No big deal. If you don't glue them in you or someone else risks losing them. that's just my opinion.
It sort of depends on the shape of the vessel and the finial. If it looks like it might be a lid for something then people will pull on it. I have one vessel that is like that and people pull on it all the time. So far it's survived. If it looks like a decoration on top then people don't pull on it. OK well some do but those guys need to be shot anyway.
I've been learning to create threads in wood so now I will sometimes simply thread them in.

 

[Richard Baker]

John, How are people supposed to know that a lid is threaded? Any chance some of the unshot ones would pull on it and strip or damage the threads? Just wondering.

 

[john lucas]

That's been the question I'm asking myself on my lidded boxes. I make both styles and need to somehow identify the ones with screw lids. Either that or make them all one way or the other.
It would take a lot of force to break the threads unless they are 20TPI. The wood needed for threading is usually quite hard and not very fragile.
As for finials even if they screw in I make them permanent unless I'm going to make a burial Urn which so far I have avoided and will continue to do so unless backed into a corner. The only reason I make them screw in was to learn the technique and to see what the pro's and con's were. You hit upon the big one, how do people know.
If you make puzzles then that's a different question.

 

[MichaelMouse]

Thank you everyone for your advice, it seemed logical to go with one that sort of pops in and out, thought about the sticking with glue , but if the finial should break and its glued in then your stumped, if it can pop in and out with minor force then you can always replace when lost or broken,
Guess I'll go with one that pops in and out.

Dab of hot glue. Reverses easily.

 

[Ruth Niles]

That's been the question I'm asking myself on my lidded boxes. I make both styles and need to somehow identify the ones with screw lids. Either that or make them all one way or the other.
It would take a lot of force to break the threads unless they are 20TPI. The wood needed for threading is usually quite hard and not very fragile.
As for finials even if they screw in I make them permanent unless I'm going to make a burial Urn which so far I have avoided and will continue to do so unless backed into a corner. The only reason I make them screw in was to learn the technique and to see what the pro's and con's were. You hit upon the big one, how do people know.
If you make puzzles then that's a different question.

John, that's "the" question, how do people know. When I pick up a piece (NOT a fragile looking one) and gently try to remove the top, if it gives any resistance, I put it down and wonder. I've seen many people do the same. I think the only answer is putting a tag "threaded lid" or "non-removable lid".

 

[john lucas]

Ruth I've decided if I do a show I will group them together with a sign that says threaded lids. Maybe leave one open so they can see.
Of course now I'm doing ornaments with threaded parts. They are meant to be gift ornaments with the thought that something could be hidden inside. My thoughts are that you would hang this on the tree every year and everyone knows it's not to be opened until Christmas. What if they get handed down without an explanation. It would look just like any other hollow ornament and no one would know it has threads.
Sometimes threaded lids can stick a little and require a little pressure to pop them loose. Not much but if you don't know you would try it and leave it. I don't know what causes this. I suppose it's friction from to flat surfaces mating very cleanly, or it could be something to do with wood movement. I tend to leave the lids mildly loose but customer, especially men, will close them firmly exasperating the problem.