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Diamond Wheel ?

n7bsn

n7bsn

Joined
Oct 29, 2005
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Location
wetter washington
Website
www.ralphandellen.us
Along the same line as the diamond hone question..

Diamond 8 inch wheels? I see Woodcraft has a 120 grit, I also see where they used to carry a 320 grit.

Anyone have any sources for 8 inch (5/8 shaft) diamond wheels, besides WoodCraft?

Thought process... we are continueing to see that we probably should be getting a scary sharp tool, it appears to me that one of the methods to do this could include going to a fine (or very-fine) diamond wheel.
 
I looked at the Woodcraft wheel and thought about it--am still thinking about it. Since I use Doug Thompson's 10v tools, I'm thinking that it might put a really nice edge on the tool.
 
It will be interesting to see how the diamond wheels work. I believe Norton and 3M both make them as well as CBN wheels which are what I use. I had a 320 grit wheel, and it didn't seem to make much difference. Some times I think it just didn't remove enough steel to resharpen the edge when it was really blunt. I now have a 150 grit wheel and it works fine.

robo hippy
 
I use a high end diamond wheel to sharpen carbide for my machine tools, but I wouldn't use it to sharpen gouges. Aluminum oxide and the state of the art ceramic/seeded gel are made for sharpening HSS/PM etc tools. Diamonds are used for carbide.

Another problem with the (relatively) cheap diamond wheel that Woodcraft sells, in combination with an import grinder with stamped flanges etc., is that it will be VERY difficult to get it running true, and it can't be dressed to fix it. I have seen this firsthand.

Diamond doesn't make things sharper, finer grits of the appropriate sharpening medium make it sharper.

FWIW, I would take exception to the assertion that diamond is the "only" effective way to hone modern pm type steels. But they didn't photgraph any of the other alternatives. The diamond hones, in particular Alan's, are nice, but a nice ceramic stone will put an even finer edge on a tool. And as Russ pointed out, there are a number of old standbys that will serve quite well.🙂

It's hard to beat the ragged edge off a 60 grit wheel for *most* green wood turning.😀

John
 
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Thanks for the input John, it's a good valid data point.

But as Nate pointed out in the slipstone thread, while you can sharpen any steel with a soft stone, is it time effective?

Given that the "hard" material is suitable, a "hard" stone will sharpen faster then a "soft" stone... and diamond is the hardest one out there.

TTFN
Ralph
 
n7bsn said:
Thanks for the input John, it's a good valid data point.

But as Nate pointed out in the slipstone thread, while you can sharpen any steel with a soft stone, is it time effective?

Given that the "hard" material is suitable, a "hard" stone will sharpen faster then a "soft" stone... and diamond is the hardest one out there.

TTFN
Ralph
Click to expand...

But the diamond is relatively coarse compared to a ceramic stone, which is also so hard it will never wear in hand usage. I have no way to look microscopically, but a ceramic slip will knock off 60 grit grinding marks in a couple of strokes, and it will certainly be finer than what's left with the diamond. I can't imagine time would be much different.

One should use what's suitable, but there's no magic here. Sharp is sharp, and there's not always a (obvious) payoff for further refinement.

John
 
A hard stone will sharpen faster than a soft one???? I thought it was the grit that made the difference, not the hardness of the wheels. Softer ones will wear out faster. My CBN wheels are very hard, to the point that they will eat a diamond dresser. The 80 grit wheel I use leaves a finer edge than an Aluminum Oxide wheel of the same grit, which makes it sharpen a bit slower than an AO wheel. When searching for the ultimate grinding wheel, I was looking into diamond. I was told by Norton, Amplex, and a guy locally who can make them that diamond is for carbide and will plug up if you use it on steel. CBN is made for grinding steel. I never talked to 3M about it, but they are making CBN wheels as well now. 3/16 inch of material bonded onto a solid aluminum core, 8 by 1 inch wheel is $300. It comes spin balanced. My 80 grit wheel is 4 years old, and still has more than 1/8 inch of material on it. You don't dress it, you use a very hard AO stick to clean it. It can get to the point of needing dressing, and you take it to the maker and have them dress it. It is done on a lathe and a hard AO wheel will take it down. You can't do this at home. I did wear out 2 320 grit wheels, and now have a 150 wheel. It will outlast the 320. I have yet to see the diamond wheels that Woodcraft is carrying. Perhaps the local store will have one in stock at our next meeting. From the picture, I don't like the flanged wheel when compared to a solid aluminum core.
robo hippy
 
Reed,
I remember reading that CBN wheels should only be ran in coolant. Is this not needed for grinding turning tools since the contact time is so limited?
Brian
 
n7bsn said:
Along the same line as the diamond hone question..

Thought process... we are continueing to see that we probably should be getting a scary sharp tool, it appears to me that one of the methods to do this could include going to a fine (or very-fine) diamond wheel.
Click to expand...

You don't need anything close to the sharpness of a plane iron or carving tool to shave wood. Waste of your time getting there. Any silica in the wood will destroy your edge, being harder than the steel, and with the amount of wood a turning tool meets compared to a carving tool, you'd be back to the hone and strop continuously.

A burnished bevel makes sense when you're looking for a burnished finished surface, but not when you're going to sand afterward. Besides, you're presenting the edge a lot differently than a chisel or carving tool presentation. Look at the teeth of your comb broadside on, and there are a lot of gaps. As you skew the angle, they disappear entirely. So with a turning edge.

Hard versus soft bond in grinding and honing is a similar balance of desire with need. Harder steels and odd shapes will score or crush paths in softer stones pretty easily. Doesn't have to be as soft as a water stone to go past the point of diminishing returns, and with a diamond hone available to clean up, why not use it? I don't use the 400 diamond that I have for carbide shaper/router bits on turning tools. No return for the effort.
 
MM Thanks for the analogy of the comb. That's a tremendous visual aid. Now if I just had enough hair to need one.
 
The guys that made my CBN wheels never said anything about fluids. With softer steels, maybe for a coolant, but not necessary for HSS. Definatly not practicle on a slow speed grinder. Maybe for a shaper knife profile and smaller diameter grinding wheel. I had thought about a CBN wheel for my Tormek which just gathers dust now. Price would probably be in the $600 plus range though.

robo hippy
 
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