Can this log be turned safely

[George Pagliarulo]

I had a tree taken down yesterday that was at end of life. I had the trunk cut into several sections. The second two photos show the ends of one of the trunk sections. You can see where the wood has separated around the circumference of the section. There is also a weak area across the middle.

It looks like this piece could make some really nice looking bowls but I’m not sure of the best and safest way to cut blanks given the flaws. The best thing to do seems to be to cut the section on either side of the seam across the middle to eliminate it. What about that separation? I’ve thought of cutting it in 1/2 across the center line and seeing if I could split out a blank along the wood separation to produce two blanks, similar to using a bowl corer.
Any ideas on the best way to handle this?
Thanks,
George

 

[hughie]

The short answer is yes. How exactly is another, as many factors will come into it lathe size, tooling and I dare say nerves of steel

 

[George Pagliarulo]

The lathe is a Nova 1624-44. I have both carbide tools and traditional bowl gouges, scrappers etc. As for my balls, the older I get the closer they get to pewter rather than steel. Oh, just realized you said nerves not balls. Nerve-wise, the older I get the less of them work.

 

[Lou Currier]

I recently did a bowl with a blank that had the same type of fissure in the middle. You probably won't be successful at coring it but have a good chance at turning out a unique bowl. I had to do several repairs and fills along the way, but the finished product was worth it.

This was a Red Gum Eucalyptus Burl.

 

[Lou Jacobs]

Looks like some kind of ornamental cherry? It looks big enough that you would likely get not-too-deep bowl blanks from the area outside the ring separation/shake. It’s a pretty dramatic case. Just be sure as you turn, you watch for other separations. Perhaps use some plastic wrap or otherwise bind the outside as you go until you’re sue it will stay in one piece. As Hughie said, fortify your nerves and stay out of the line of fire.

 

[hockenbery]

Any ideas on the best way to handle this?

Be cautious be safe

This piiece has serious structural defects that you should work around or fix structurally.
smaller pieces should be ok but do check for defects.
The defect across the center may be hinge tearout from the felling or it might be a bark inclusion.


If you have turned 15-20 sphere you have the opportunity to turn a hollow sphere.
You also need a lathe with a decent tailstock that will hold for between center turning.
This will impress fellow Woodturners.
This is a medium level undertaking but you don’t want to try it unless you have turned lots of spheres.

I cut the blank so the ring shake is in the center and close to straight across. Tailstock pressure will hold it together.
I rough turn a ball with a tenon on each end. Then hollow each half. I use a round disc as a template.
Leave the walls 3/8” thick 1/2 if you are timid.
Glue the two halfs together with epoxy. I sometime put a quarter inside so you get a rattle.
Unless you lose a splinter the glued together ring shake will look like every other growth ring.
Give the epoxy a day then turn the sphere doing the 3 axis rotations.
Remember it’s hollow so don’t take any more than 3/16 off anywhere.

 

[Lou Jacobs]

If you have turned 15-20 balls you have the opportunity to turn a hollow ball.
You also need a lathe with a decent tailstock that will hold for between center turning.
This will impress fellow Woodturners.
This is a medium level undertaking but you don’t want to try it unless you have turned lots of balls.

Al, I think (unless I’m way off base here) that George was talking about anatomical balls!

 

[hockenbery]

Al, I think (unless I’m way off base here) that George was talking about anatomical balls!

I get that but to my thinking the only use for a ring shake is tuning hollow spheres.
And easy to split fire wood.

 

[William Rogers]

Before I knew better. I had a piece of walnut on the lathe making a vase it was around 8-9 diameter at the time. The defect didn't look near as significant as yours. What happened was it opened up and came around and bent my steel tool rest. Didn't break apart, just opened up. If it had been a cast tool rest it could have broke and caused more concern. Knowing better now I don’t turn anything like that. I have cut the defect away and turned a smaller piece.

 

[George Pagliarulo]

Have never turned a sphere so I guess I won’t be doing that.
The center defect is definitely not from felling since it wasn’t…felled (?).
The trunk was only about 5’ high and cut into cookies where it stood.

 

[Gerald Lawrence]

I could see a lot of boxes in your future.

 

[Russell Nugent]

Probably lots of good wood in there. I would suggest cutting it the way Hockenberry suggested. Avoid the ring shake and you'll probably get some nice blanks. I've had a few trees where I've gotten creative working around ring shake to cut blanks

 

[hockenbery]

The trunk was only about 5’ high and cut into cookies where it stood.

Do be aware that the ring shake will most likely run the full five feet
You may not be able to see it in all the cookies.

An un seen ring shake is extremely dangerous. You can sometimes have some connected wood as you turn the connecting wood gets cut too thin to hold and the wood separates and goes flying.

 

[Mark Jundanian]

The lathe is a Nova 1624-44.

I have the same lathe. Those pieces look larger and more unbalanced then I would take for a spin. Have you turned ungainly pieces like these before on your 1624? Do you have the cast iron legs, or steel?

 

[Richard Coers]

Can you turn it, or should you turn it is two different things. I would never turn any part of it with that seperation ring. I'm not sure that is ring shake, looks like a lightning strike to me. Looks like it was damaged on the outside so badly it never could heal. Lightning boils the lignum and it will crack even more as it dries. I had a beautiful hard maple with just brilliant colors caused by a bacterial infection from the lightning damage. I was lucky to get even pen blanks out of it without lots of checking.

 

[John Ames]

Can you turn it, or should you turn it is two different things.

This is exactly right…. I would turn that log all day long. I would take precautions and use lots of epoxy/glue/inserts/tape and anything else necessary.

But I’m a weirdo and in the farthest end of the tiniest minority of turners who ONLY turn junk wood.

Before you think about IF you should turn it, figure out why you would want to? What is the goal? Do you sell pieces? Are you bored with good wood and want a challenge? Is the tree significant in some way to you? Are you trying to make a whole set of bowls/utensils for your own use or as a gift?

If you’re willing to put in the time and energy (and $$) ANYTHING is turnable/salvageable.

I sell my work and I’m lucky to have consistent customers who like what I do. For me, it would be totally worth it, a fun challenge, and a very good money maker.

 

[Tim Hanus]

I had a tree taken down yesterday that was at end of life. I had the trunk cut into several sections. The second two photos show the ends of one of the trunk sections. You can see where the wood has separated around the circumference of the section. There is also a weak area across the middle.

It looks like this piece could make some really nice looking bowls but I’m not sure of the best and safest way to cut blanks given the flaws. The best thing to do seems to be to cut the section on either side of the seam across the middle to eliminate it. What about that separation? I’ve thought of cutting it in 1/2 across the center line and seeing if I could split out a blank along the wood separation to produce two blanks, similar to using a bowl corer.
Any ideas on the best way to handle this?
Thanks,
George
View attachment 66258
View attachment 66256View attachment 66257

I think my attempt would be to cut in this order and hopefully you can cut straighter than I can draw with a mouse.

 

[Dave Landers]

I think my attempt would be to cut in this order and hopefully you can cut straighter than I can draw with a mouse.

A reasonable start, but just to be clear, there's still danger areas in the blanks that makes.
The red is definitely dangerous, which is probably obvious since it's already coming apart. Needs to be cut away before turning. I've marked a couple other spots in yellow that also look suspicious to me. Might just be marks from the saw or something, but could be other ring shake evidence. If so, that entire growth ring all around the tree is likely compromised.


One strategy (that helps but is not fool-proof) is to take each blank before it goes on the lathe, and throw it down hard onto a concrete floor (driveway etc) a few times. If it comes apart, that's a clue. But also listen to hear if it sounds solid or not.

 

[robo hippy]

Well, for me, I would not put it on a lathe at all. I do make bowls intended for daily use though. Ring shake, big danger. Bark inclusion, big danger. Dave's lay out up above would work for smaller bowls. Probably similar for spheres.

robo hippy

 

[Robert Levin]

The lathe is a Nova 1624-44. I have both carbide tools and traditional bowl gouges, scrappers etc. As for my balls, the older I get the closer they get to pewter rather than steel. Oh, just realized you said nerves not balls. Nerve-wise, the older I get the less of them work.

I know the feeling!

 

[Robert Levin]

Before I knew better. I had a piece of walnut on the lathe making a vase it was around 8-9 diameter at the time. The defect didn't look near as significant as yours. What happened was it opened up and came around and bent my steel tool rest. Didn't break apart, just opened up. If it had been a cast tool rest it could have broke and caused more concern. Knowing better now I don’t turn anything like that. I have cut the defect away and turned a smaller piece.

I do the same - better safe than sorry!

 

[Doug Rasmussen]

To make objects out of questionable wood those of us who use CNC machines don't have problems. The wood can be stationary on the machine table with the tool moving respect to wood.

 

[Walt Ahlgrim]

Life is too short to turn crappy wood. JJ

Remember this stuff literally grows on trees. If you want to make bowls find different wood. If you must turn this wood cut out the defects but my guess is what is left will be pretty small.



Walt