Advise needed

[Richard Elliott]

My brother saved this three way fork out of an oak tree that came down in a storm. I need and would greatly appreciate any and all advice on how best to begin here!

I have a Jet 1642 and have successfully completed a couple of 14 inch plus bowls. However I prefer to stay in the 8 to 12 inch range and really enjoy finding the best way to display the figure in a piece. I have turned a couple of smaller hollow forms out of oak but have no experience with crotch figure in oak. The wood is green and Anchor Sealed.

So, my questions are:
Does oak even exhibit a crotch figure worth pursuing?
Would it make sense to try to get a smaller bowl or maybe a hollow form from on top of and between all three piths?
Will tuning green to 10% thickness for twice turning work with figured oak or do I need to go straight to final thickness?
If I were to try leaving any piths in a bowl how thin would I need to go to allow them to pucker out without cracking?

Thanks in advance for all suggestions!

 

[Kevin Jenness]

I would first slice lengthwise on a line connecting the centers of the two large limbs, and second on a line between the largest and smallest limb centers. It's hard to predict what you will find inside except that the best figure is often concentrated in a fairly thin section. I would locate that area in the bottom of a bowl or the top of a platter and think about using a very shallow tenon, recess or a glue block to minimize the loss of that figured section to holding the piece. Leaving pith sections in is chancy but if doing so thinner is better, meaning once-turned.

 

[hockenbery]

Looks like a fun crotch to explore…. You will have to do some cutting to fit your lathe..
Hard not to cut off something you might want to keep….

Does oak even exhibit a crotch figure worth pursuing?

Yes. These are some unfinished oak NE bowls .

Would it make sense to try to get a smaller bowl or maybe a hollow form from on top of and between all three piths?

. You could do an end grain NE bowl the 3 rims will be a feature you won’t get the feather grain of the crotch
Here is a choice between a shallow bowl a one deeper than wide or a vase shape.

Will tuning green to 10% thickness for twice turning work with figured oak or do I need to go straight to final thickness?

. Usually. Even walls, nice curves

If I were to try leaving any piths in a bowl how thin would I need to go to allow them to pucker out without cracking

Who knows until you try. A curve so it can pucker helps. 1/16” almost a 100%
1/2” gets close to 0% 3/16 probably if you slow the drying in paper bags

You might consider making this cut
It will show if there is a bark inclusion and whether there is a nice flame. The flame is below where the leaders join.
It’s looks to be the more symmetrical and sizewise closer to fitting on your lathe. Might get a 15” heart shape blank

You can try for a heart shaped NE bowl turned facegrain.
The pdf and demo video may give you some ideas.

Naural edge bowl from a crotch

Turning a crotch is fun and produces a heart shaped bowl with a highly figured bottom. I put a video from a demo I did in may on YouTube. These are nice bowls for turners who have done 4-5 natural edge bowls without getting a catch. While best suited for intermediate and advanced beginners...

www.aawforum.org

 

[Gary Beasley]

My experience with oak, especially red oak, is its bad to crack while drying so either turn to finish or be sure to dry the rough turnings slowly. Once dry oak is not the easiest to turn so be sure to use the sharpest tools.

 

[Ken Dambrosio]

Over the years many of my friends dropped off various varieties of Northern oaks, I was always glad to see a crotch to turn, never knowing what to expect. Some of the oak crutches had a lot of configuration others were just normal and not so interesting. I never was truly fond of oaks until I moved to Florida, there are over 26 different species, and was able to come across Oak burls that were extremely interesting. Post the finished piece, best of luck.

 

[robo hippy]

Some trees have crotch figure, some don't. As near as I can tell, when the tree is out in a valley or plane, then it will have good crotch figure. If it is protected from winds like by lots of other trees or down in the bottom of a steep valley, it won't have much crotch figure. I never was able to figure a way to cut a 3 way crotch well enough to get a good piece out of it that had all 3 crotches in it. Maybe an end grain vase or winged bowl? Side note, the crotch figure starts under the limbs, so the best part of the figure is well under the branches.

robo hippy

 

[Monty Ivy]

Here is my take. Should be able to get 3 blanks out of this.

 

[Richard Elliott]

Thanks for all the helpful advice .
I find the suggestions to start by slabbing off outside the piths reassuring as this would have been my chosen approach. With all suggested cutting illustrations in agreement I am going to try for three shallow bowls or platters from the slabs then try to figure out what to do with the center. I only have a One Way boring bar (1/2”) so maybe this could be my excuse to add a hollowing rig to my tool collection!

Gary you suggest really slow drying. Would anchor sealing as well as paper bags slow it sufficiently in a climate controlled shop?

Robo, I’m disappointed to hear stress may induce more prominent figure. This tree was of average height (60 or 70 feet) in a mature timber just slightly up the hillside from the creek bottom. I don’t think it had a great deal of wind stress until the end!

Kevin, I appreciate your response and especially the point of using glue blocks. If I’m putting the chainsaw through whatever figure may be there I’ve already lost a significant amount.

Hockenbery, your direct answers to each question are most helpful. The pdf and video of your demo have given me additional pointers.

I’ll hopefully have time over the weekend to slice those piths and “unwrap” this last Christmas present. Pictures to follow.

Thanks again to all.

 

[hockenbery]

If you find a bark inclusion. Remember the bark has no structural strength.
Be sure the mounting point is all solid wood and no bark.

Hope you find good pretty wood.

 

[Dave Landers]

Make sure you pay attention - even take notes if that's your style - to how you cut it and what you get. And what you maybe could have done differently. Every crotch you process can help you develop that intuition for what to do with the next one.

 

[Russ Braun]

OK, Hijacking Thread for a moment.

Monty, you've been a regular on the forum for several months now, and your avatar still creeps me out. Would you consider switching to something tamer? Maybe your "behind on the copy machine" photo would be less distracting.

Carry on.

May the Force be with you Dean!!

 

[Richard Elliott]

Thanks for the reminder Dave. Keeping clear, well organized notes has never been a strength of mine. But thanks to the smartphone in my pocket I continue to improve my “note taking” using searchable photos.

 

[Russ Braun]

Thanks for the reminder Dave. Keeping clear, well organized notes has never been a strength of mine. But thanks to the smartphone in my pocket I continue to improve my “note taking” using searchable photos.

Huh?? Mine just texts and plays music, lol!!

 

[Michael Anderson]

Richard, I would suggest a slightly different approach to the crotch—cut it so you get two nice live edge bowls, hopefully with some feather/crotch figure in the bottom. Do this with hockenberry’s suggested first cut, and Monty’s suggested third cut. Then with the remaining chunk, make a nice calabash. You should be able to cut it so you get three piths, which will be very interesting on the outside, especially if you have swaths of sapwood included. My two cents.

 

[Gary Beasley]

I use paper bags set on a shelf away from direct air circulation for drying and get decent results most of the time. The splitting usually happens with red oak left too thick or taken out of the bag too soon. Sometimes it just splits no matter what. The worst I had was a black walnut root ball though. The more piths the the more cracks. Just have to learn to deal with them.

 

[Richard Elliott]

Michael, thanks for a slightly different perspective. I had not considered that possibility. I was not able to take the time to begin processing it today and we have plans for tomorrow as well as next weekend! I’m beginning to miss that COVID lockdown…..had LOTS of good shop time! ;-)

Gary, I have been successfully using paper bags but unless anyone sees a problem with a single paper bag AND Anchor Seal I think I’ll take that route on this oak hoping to maximize my chances of success.
Thanks for your input.

 

[Rusty Nesmith]

I think I would cut it like Monty suggested.

 

[robo hippy]

It did take a while to figure out Monty's avatar.... My comment would be, "May the Farce be with you"..... I do kind of have a sarcastic side to me.... Old hippies don't get offended by much....

robo hippy

 

[Richard Elliott]

I finally got an opportunity to start processing this crotch piece. I cut it according to Monty’s suggestion and came up with these pieces.
I have cut blanks as drawn..One straight grain piece for a spindle blank or a couple of boxes, a ten inch bowl blank and a six inch hollow form. This is my progress thus far on the HF which allows me to see the figure and get a little idea as to the thickness of it.
Overall I’m pleased with what nature has given me to work with. Now if I can do it justice!

 

[John Erickson]

That hollow form is highlighting the figure nicely. Well done!