1. Welcome new registering member. Your username must be your real First and Last name (for example: John Doe). "Screen names" and "handles" are not allowed and your registration will be deleted if you don't use your real name. Also, do not use all caps nor all lower case.

New T.B. Visualizer and 3/4" stabilizer

Discussion in 'Woodturning Discussion Forum' started by Breck Whitworth, Nov 15, 2018.

  1. Breck Whitworth

    Breck Whitworth Sharp Dressed Woodturner

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Location (City & State):
    Gulfport, MS
    Home Page:
    Well the Lord blessed me with a good local art festival and now all my reasons for not getting into hollow forms seriously have suddenly disappeared. You know going to AAW Symposiums can really open your eyes to some of the incredible turning tools that are out there. First Brent let me try an American Beauty while there in Atlanta. About 9 months later a new Robust American Beauty was born at my place in MS. Best lathe for me I can imagine, love the stainless steel bed, the gas shock assist for tilt away is a dream. I digress, well I have made a few hollow forms over the years, but never got into making them mainly because I lacked the knowledge and skills and tools. My turning buddy and good friend in Georgia pulled the trigger on Trent Bosch's visualizer and stabilizer a year or so ago and what he has turned out is amazing in such a short time, I always told him that when it got to where handling 75 lb+ blocks of wood for large salad bowls got to be harder and harder I would add to my turning skills hollow form turning. My new Trent Bosch 3/4" Stabilizer and his visualizer are out of the box and I hope to get started tomorrow.
    Any advice or tips about this system would be appreciated from those of you who actually own one or have used one enough to share your wisdom with me. Thanks
     
  2. Steve Nix

    Steve Nix

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2015
    Messages:
    38
    Location (City & State):
    Louisiana
    I have the 3/4 stabilizer and love it. Solid and well built. I built my own version or the visualizer and lazer system and they work great. Hope you enjoy yours.
     
  3. Lamar Wright

    Lamar Wright

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2017
    Messages:
    681
    Location (City & State):
    Jasper, Alabama
    Good news Breck! I know that you will enjoy the TB stabilizer. Been thinking of doing my first HF soon but I'm still trying to prefect my bowls and platters at the moment.:D
     
  4. Richard Coers

    Richard Coers

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,093
    Location (City & State):
    Peoria, Illinois
    Your choice of course, but the visualizer is so simple you can make your own for less than $100. I use an free old laptop, so I have $20 invested in mine. That includes the dry erase marker.
     
  5. Fadi Zeidan

    Fadi Zeidan

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2016
    Messages:
    469
    Location (City & State):
    San Antonio, TX
    Simon Hope has cheaper alternative as well
     
  6. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2004
    Messages:
    6,683
    Location (City & State):
    Lakeland, Florida
    Home Page:
    The visualizer and the stabilizer are a pleasure to use.

    The visualizer is absolutely amazing. I am good enough at hollowing with a lazer to teach and demo lots of places but the visualizer brought a whole new level of confidence to my hollowing that I did not think possible. The lazer is only true on a tiny bit of the curved forms I hollow and has to be reset every,couple inches into the form. This makes the lazer off just a bit as I work further into the form from where it was set. Knowing the measure is off, I continue to hollow until my anxiety level gets high enough to make me quit hollowing to adjust the laser.
    The visualizer is anxiety free. It is always correct and every time the tool comes out there is an instant check that nothing has come loose or shifted.

    I came up with the idea to draw the shapes of my cutters on a card with the the cut line drawn on the card. This makes it quick to draw on the screen overlay.
    Trent expanded on this idea with a card that has several thicknesses on on it.

    As far as the stabilizer just take the time to set it up to cut on center at the bottom of your form.
    Make sure the cutter is level.
    This will eliminate any mini volcanoes in the bottom center. ( I use the the Hope and the Jamieson)
    Have done two HF with the stabilizer - just prefer the support mechanism behind me so I can work closer to the wood. The stabilizer is a nice system
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2018
  7. Dennis J Gooding

    Dennis J Gooding

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    628
    Location (City & State):
    Grants Pass Oregon
    For another approach to marking cutter position, see my post of August 17, 2017.
     
  8. Breck Whitworth

    Breck Whitworth Sharp Dressed Woodturner

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Location (City & State):
    Gulfport, MS
    Home Page:
    Richard I am jealous of your knowledge and patience to get it done for $20. bucks.Oh well. I just got everything set up now for fine turning it. (I edited my stupid answer after I drew the image of the tool, now I understand). Dennis I will check out your post for Aug. 17,2017 thanks for everyone's input.
    hockenbery Great idea to have a card for the outlines I will try that also.
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2018
  9. Karl Loeblein

    Karl Loeblein

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2018
    Messages:
    154
    Location (City & State):
    Millington, TN
    Richard, What make & model of camera are you using, and how are you getting the camera signal to your laptop?
     
  10. Richard Coers

    Richard Coers

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2009
    Messages:
    1,093
    Location (City & State):
    Peoria, Illinois
  11. RichColvin

    RichColvin

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2016
    Messages:
    466
    Location (City & State):
    Marysville, OH
    Home Page:
    Karl,
    What I used is :
    • Camera : Swann Microcam 720p Security Camera, 1 megapixel resolution. $25 @ Micro Center.
      • The camera uses a BNC Connector (a BNC cable and power plug come with the kit)
      • The camera attached to the arm where my laser had been attached. I hold it in place by a small hose clamp. A small block of wood between the camera body and the hose clamp keeps it from pivoting on it's axis (from vibration in the woodturning process).
    • Adapter (to convert the BNC cable from the camera to the VGA cable for the monitor): VGA video PC converter adapter with BNC$18 @ Amazon
    • Standard VGA cable (usually has blue ends) - I already had an unused one
    • Computer Monitor - I already had an unused one
    Kind regards,
    Rich
     
  12. Stan Semeniuk

    Stan Semeniuk

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Messages:
    83
    Location (City & State):
    Edmonton,AB,Canada
    Breck, I am very interested to hear about your coming experiences. I have been very happy with my new stabilizer and have been sitting on the fence about the visualizer. I hope to hear a review in the near future.:)
     
  13. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2004
    Messages:
    6,683
    Location (City & State):
    Lakeland, Florida
    Home Page:
    When Trent invented the visualizer and began showing it my reaction like many others is - it can’t be that simple.
    Yet here was the visual proof that the cameras moving in a fixed position above the tool tip would keep the tool tip and the hollowing bar in the same position in the screen. Incredible genius. How many thousands of people hollow in front of cameras at demos and such. And one guy figures out how to use it for accurately determining wall thickness. Genius! Most of us are familiar with back up cameras that show our bumber moving closer to objects. Same visual feedback for turning.

    I’m a decent “tier 2” hollow turner. I have done hollowing demos with a lazer pointer at AAW and 4 regional symposiums. I did a demo with the Bosch visualizer a few years ago at the Florida Symposium.
    For me the visualizer so much better than the laser pointer. Gets accurate wall thickness with the visual feed back. Just as fast overall as using the laser.
     
  14. Dennis J Gooding

    Dennis J Gooding

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    628
    Location (City & State):
    Grants Pass Oregon
    A bit of caution. I don't know whether the visualizer manual mentions this, but make sure to position the image of the cutting tool tip close to the center of the screen (which should also be the center of the camera field of view). Otherwise, parallax error will lead to an over-estimate of wall thickness. This is particularly important if the diameter of the work piece is not very small compared to the distance from camera lens to the spin axis of the work piece.
     
    hockenbery likes this.
  15. Jerry George

    Jerry George

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2018
    Messages:
    21
    Location (City & State):
    Cross Plains, Texas
  16. Bill Boehme

    Bill Boehme Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2005
    Messages:
    11,443
    Location (City & State):
    Dalworthington Gardens, TX
    Home Page:
    Here is a link to the thread that you mentioned: camera for hollowing system
     
    Stan Semeniuk likes this.
  17. Dennis J Gooding

    Dennis J Gooding

    Joined:
    Apr 10, 2010
    Messages:
    628
    Location (City & State):
    Grants Pass Oregon
    Actually, the thickness is overestimated if the tool tip image is placed below the center of the screen and underestimated if it is placed above center. If the image is placed to the right or left of center, the direction of the error will depend on the lengthwise slope of the work piece a the point of cutting.
     
  18. Dennis Weiner

    Dennis Weiner

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2012
    Messages:
    220
    Location (City & State):
    New City, NY
    Will the visualizer be able to track cutter position throughout the range of a big hollow form. Say, 12” x 28” vase? Is the camera able to fit a piece that big on screen. (My ceiling is only 7’)
     
  19. hockenbery

    hockenbery AAW Advisor Staff Member

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2004
    Messages:
    6,683
    Location (City & State):
    Lakeland, Florida
    Home Page:
    Yes to tracking the cutter position. You would need a longer support rod for the camera. The one that comes with it can extend out about 2 feet. You would need extend the camera out further for your hollowing bar to however far out your cutter is from the mounting point of the camera support.

    No to fitting a piece that big on the screen.

    The camera is positioned vertically above the the cutter tip so it track wherever the cutter is just like a backup camera shows your bumper.

    The way I have mine mounted I see about 9” in front and behid the cutter and maybe 6” to the left and right of the cutter. I can turn at least a 24” diameter piece. Most of what I turn is in the 14-12 diameter range. I only see part of the form but always see the wall thickness whe the side wall is on the screen.
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2018
  20. Bill Boehme

    Bill Boehme Administrator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2005
    Messages:
    11,443
    Location (City & State):
    Dalworthington Gardens, TX
    Home Page:
    The camera is always directly above the cutting edge so tracking the cutter is not an issue. You might not be able to see all of a hollowform if it is abnormally large, but really you are only interested in what's going on in the immediate vicinity of the cutter
     
  21. Karl Loeblein

    Karl Loeblein

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2018
    Messages:
    154
    Location (City & State):
    Millington, TN
    That
    Rich, I've been trying to find a narrow focus camera with a decent focal distance, but sadly that Swann Microcam doesn't appear to be made anymore. Maybe the endoscope camera's are the way to go now.

    Edit: Found Microcam on Amazon, but price went up to $45.

    Thanks,
    Karl
     
    Paul Lajoie likes this.
  22. RichColvin

    RichColvin

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2016
    Messages:
    466
    Location (City & State):
    Marysville, OH
    Home Page:
    Karl,

    Thanks for the update!

    Kind regards,
    Rich
     
  23. Steve Doerr

    Steve Doerr

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    61
    Location (City & State):
    Joplin, Missouri
    Breck, I got the 3/4" Stabilizer and Visualizer in August and have used it for a couple of 12" deep HF. I find it to be much more stable than the Monster that I had been using previously. A couple of thoughts/comments that might be helpful:
    1. I had converted my Monster to a camera system using a car backup camera and video screen. There was a lot of vibration on the camera arm and I was constantly having to tighten the camera because it would move on me. Other wise it was better than the laser.
    2. The camera on the visualizer is a much better camera and is better secured. You can also adjust the focus on the camera should you need to.
    3. I'm still learning on how to use the Stabilizer, as I have a tendency to try and hog out too much wood with each cut. This has caused me to have some vibration issues especially as I get toward the bottom of my large HFs. The vibration has caused me to have to re-tighten the set screws holding the gouge and the set screw holding the support post for the camera. I have used some plumbers Teflon tape and that has helped some what.
    4. Make sure to check the tool and screen alignment as it will drift on you a little bit if you're not careful. If it gets completely out of alignment, I have found it is easier to create a new image on the monitor than try to get it re-aligned.
    5. Keep the cuttings inside the HF to a minimum. Blowing them out frequently will make a big difference on the vibration.

    Overall, this is a very good system. I like the size of the monitor and the little card that comes with it for tracing out your distance around the tool is a life saver. The stabilizer is very well built and very stable. I also like the fact that Trent included the adapters for 1/2" and 5/8" tools. Which give the 3/4" stabilizer a lot of flexibility. I just notice that he has now come out with 1" hollowing tools that will fit the 3/4" stabilizer and go to 14" depth. (Good thing Christmas is coming ;);))

    Good luck and look forward to seeing some new HF as a result of these new toys tools. PM me if you have any other questions.
    Steve
     
    Paul Lajoie and hockenbery like this.
  24. Breck Whitworth

    Breck Whitworth Sharp Dressed Woodturner

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Location (City & State):
    Gulfport, MS
    Home Page:
    Hi Steve, good to hear from you again, I agree Trents stabilizer is much better than my old monster system. This is my first attempt at a hollow form using Trent's new 3/4 stabilizer and visualizer. I personally love the visualizer for getting the interior edge to the desired thickness. This system is perfect for me for accomplishing what was always the hardest aspect to turning hollow forms and that is wall thickness. So much better than a laser. This is a 9" spalted sweet gum form Not my best by any means but it was fun and a learning exercise using my new system, opening started at 1" ended up 1-1/8" after sanding. My second one is also 9-1/4" tall. I plan on adding a top to the wide mouth one.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 22, 2018
  25. Steve Doerr

    Steve Doerr

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2011
    Messages:
    61
    Location (City & State):
    Joplin, Missouri
    Looks good Breck. It has been awhile since we have corresponded. Glad to hear everything is going well for you. I'm working on a 10" HF and will focus on wall thickness as well. Every turning is always a learning process with the hopeful outcome to improve your skills.

    Are you planning on going to the AAW Symposium in NC in June. My sister lives in Raleigh, so we are going to combine a visit to her with a visit to the symposium. Let me know, I'd love to meet with you and visit.
     
  26. Breck Whitworth

    Breck Whitworth Sharp Dressed Woodturner

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    212
    Location (City & State):
    Gulfport, MS
    Home Page:
    Steve the last National symposium I attended was in Atlanta, If I am not mistaken this is the first one close enough for me to drive to again so Lord willing I will checking into the logistics of going. If I do I would love to meet with you there.
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice