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Made some rests today

Discussion in 'Woodturning Discussion Forum' started by Bruce Miller, Nov 15, 2020.

  1. Bruce Miller

    Bruce Miller

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    I'm Not a welder and these pictures will prove that. But I'm not embarrassed enough not to post pictures of my work because it is at least functional. Its welded with the least amount of inclusions I could do for my skillset anyway. This is done on a tombstone stick welder.

    I never liked the cast iron one that came with the lathe. I've filed and sanded it smooth multiple times but I just can't seem to get the tool to ride smooth on it.

    I ordered the bar stock and rod quite some time ago and I welded up the curved bowl rest along with the box rest back then.

    Today I welded up the 12" straight rest to complete my set....For now.
    They're made of 3/8" thick bar stock for both the curved bowl and straight rest, the straight is two lengths of bar stock welded on 45* to give me a finger guide to ride along the length with.

    I ground out the welds so it'll be smooth for that traverse along the length, That was a lot of grinding.
    They both have 3/8" hardened rod welded to the tops of them

    The box rest is made from 1/2" thick bar stock because it's laying flat on it's side so I went with the thicker material for more strength.

    Anyway here they are;
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  2. RichColvin

    RichColvin

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    Bruce,

    Your tone seems apologetic, but the pictures you added show some really fine work. I’m a believer that the beauty is not about the tool, but the objects made by the tool.

    The only enhancement I would advocate is to chamfer the bottom of the post. That would make it easier to insert into the banjo. But overall, these look really good.

    Kind regards,
    Rich
     
    Bruce Miller likes this.
  3. Bob Sheppard

    Bob Sheppard

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    Bruce-
    I recently made a couple of long tool rests for my spindle turning. I don't weld, so I drilled and tapped the posts, and bolted the angle iron rest to them. I'll try to remember to post some pics of them tomorrow.
     
    Bruce Miller likes this.
  4. Timothy Allen

    Timothy Allen

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    Yes, and it doesn't take much of a chamfer to make a big difference, and it is really easy to do. And yes, great job!
     
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  5. Lou Jacobs

    Lou Jacobs

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    Awesome job! I took a beginning welding course right before COVID hit, thinking I would make a tool rest. Now the place where I took the class is locked down. You’re inspiring me to try to track down a stick welder and do this at home.
     
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  6. john lucas

    john lucas AAW Forum Expert

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    Very good job. If it wasn't for an angle grinder I would be a horrible welder. :)
     
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  7. Lamar Wright

    Lamar Wright

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    Bruce I think you did an outstanding job with the rests. Well done!
     
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  8. Bruce Miller

    Bruce Miller

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    Lou that’s what I did a couple years ago, just bought a Lincoln 220 v stick welder watched a whole bunch of videos and melted a lot of sticks.
    As John says “ if it wasn’t for an angle grinder I’d be a horrible welder” also .
    But as it is, it’s functional at worst and that’s just fine with me.
    I’m glad that this will give you inspiration to go at it by yourself, I get a lot of satisfaction welding stuff for utilitarian purposes.
     
  9. robo hippy

    robo hippy

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    They are kind of like me. I ain't pretty, but I can get the job done.... What did you use for your hardened rod? The A2 is standard drill rod, and you have to get it hardened to make it like the commercial tool rests. I had some hardened and welded on, and the welding heat did not do anything to the hardness of the rod. The A2 as it comes is still pretty hard, but you can dent and ding it. Once hardened, you can leave scuff marks in it, but don't do anything to it other than that. I tried a file and a hack saw blade for my tests.

    robo hippy
     
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  10. Bob Sheppard

    Bob Sheppard

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    Bruce- here's a pic of the 2 rests that I made. I do a fair amount of spindle turning, and was getting frustrated moving the rest all the time. One rest is 25", the other is 33". I drilled and tapped to post while it was on my lathe. I used Type 8 bolts to fasten it all together, then painted the angle iron
    BTW, looking at your rest is making me thinking about playing around and learning welding. It'd be nice to add a hardened rod to the top of my rests.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. odie

    odie

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    @Bruce Miller

    Those really do look like an awesome job, Bruce. :D

    What did you use to attach you hardened rod to the supporting base?

    My only comment would be regarding this one:
    [​IMG]
    Most tool rests with a long overhang like this one are either very thick, or have a supporting base that's rather tall near the post, and tapers out to the end. The reasoning behind this, is to eliminate the tendency to flex while the tool is cutting further out from the post, resulting in a pulsating downward force. The reason why it pulsates, is because the resistance to the cut is more pronounced while cutting the end grain, as opposed to the long grain. If you pay attention to this, it can be felt in your hands while turning. This, in combination with a tendency of the tool rest to flex will prevent you from getting the very best cut possible. There are many other factors involved in getting the best cut possible, but these are certainly relevant contributing factors.

    edit: This tool rest could easily be beefed up a bit with some supporting material added near the post, and tapered out to the end.......should you consider that! By all means, I really do think you are doing an excellent job on these rests. Much better than I'm capable of with my acetylene welder. I did make one tool rest before I retired, but back then I had accesses to a MIG welder. The rest are all commercially made, and I'm feeling satisfied with what is available these days. ;)

    -----odie-----

    .
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2020
  12. Bruce Miller

    Bruce Miller

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    Yes Odie I know what you mean about support up under the arm and I may decide to add that in the future. I have used it once before with no issue but I suppose it won't hurt to do anyway.
    The rod is welded on the back side only as to not interfere with my finger sliding by. As I understand I'm not supposed to use the rest as a finger guide but I find that this is how I can get my best cuts , at least at this stage in my turning.

    Reed I don't recall the hardness of the rod that I bought, it was from an online site, I'll have to go through my purchases to find out, which I will because now you've got my curiosity up.
     
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  13. Bruce Miller

    Bruce Miller

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    Bob do you have two banjos or something. I imagine at 33" you would certainly need two supports for sure. I can see the desire to have long rests for spindle turning, I just so happened to try my hand at spindle turning using a skew chisel for the first time tonight. Nothing too intense, just some simple cuts like the planing and shaving cuts.
    I was watching John Lucas's video(thank you too John for taking the time to make the video) along with Allen Batty, This YouTube stuff is going to get me in trouble.
     
  14. robo hippy

    robo hippy

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    If you buy the drill rod, it does not come hardened. There are 3 types of drill rod, A which is air hardened, W which is water hardened, and O which is oil hardened. They are generally machined, and then hardened by some heating process, which is beyond my abilities to do. If you have it done commercially, they charge by the pound for the process. The A2 is much better than cast iron, but not as good as hardened A2. I know that D Way has special tool rests for boxes, and they case harden theirs. Excellent rests, but I have no clue as to what the exact hardening process is. Need some pro to chime in here...

    robo hippy
     
  15. Tom De Winter

    Tom De Winter

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    I too did a couple rests this month. I used O1 drill rod and did not heat treat. I've got a few hours on the 6" rest and it's starting to show slight undulations on the surface.

    I don't know much about heat treating but wonder if I could improve the situation by bringing the rods to cherry red and quenching in oil.

    Ya, my welding could improve a bit. I used to do beautiful tig welds but not as steady nor can I see as well as I used too. Doesn't help that I only pick up the tig torch a few times a year.

    3inch Rest.JPG 6inch Rest.JPG
     
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  16. Gary Beasley

    Gary Beasley

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    Use a magnet when you heat for hardening, when the magnet quits sticking its hit the right temperature to dunk it in the oil.
     
  17. Bob Sheppard

    Bob Sheppard

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    Bruce- Yes, I have 2 banjos for my lathe. I have a Jet 1642 lathe. Jet wanted around $260-270 for a banjo, which I was reluctant to pay. Then I had a thought- one of the Grizzly lathes is a copy of mine. I looked on their site, and was able to buy a Grizzly banjo for around $90. Yeah, its Grizzly green, instead of Jet white, but I'm OK with that.
    This is a good thread. Thanks for starting it.
     
  18. Bruce Miller

    Bruce Miller

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    Reed(and who ever else might be interested) I went back to find I ordered the rod from McMaster Carr
    https://www.mcmaster.com/8935K336/.
    Hardened Multipurpose 4140 Alloy Steel Rod
    It is a pre-hardened alloy which now I remember was one of the reasons I bought it. It's not one of you super steels but so far anyway it seems to be holding up.
     
  19. Dean Center

    Dean Center

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    Alan Lacer made a video on tool making that presents in clear fashion the topic of hardening the steels we're likely to use. It's still voodoo to me, but step by step voodoo with his instructions.
     
  20. Larry Copas

    Larry Copas

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    The high carbon content of tool steels such as O1 and A2 make them very hard to weld properly. The weld can be quite brittle. After welding you need a heat treating oven to get the steel hard.

    Alloy steel such as 4140 are difficult to weld but doable. Of course the heat from welding anneals the steel so it also would need to be hardened.

    I've made a lot of tool rests with 4140 and other times with cold rolled low carbon steel. Also made a couple from O1. I'm not particularly hard on a tool rest, so I'm happy with plain old low carbon steel.
     
  21. Bruce Miller

    Bruce Miller

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    Sounds as though I’ll need to look into re-hardening the rests I’ve made.
    I too am not to terribly hard on my rests but one little ding on them seems to muck up the works because I’ll always seem to find that ding
     
  22. Richard Coers

    Richard Coers

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    hockenbery likes this.
  23. robo hippy

    robo hippy

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    Larry, when first starting to make my rests, we experimented with what the welding did to the hardened drill rod. They made sure to get one end cherry red hot to see if it would change the hardness of the drill rod. Using a file and hack saw blade, we tried to damage it. It left some scuff marks but didn't seem to bother the hardness at all. In using them, I haven't found any soft spots. No clue as to why. The only thing I really know about metal is how to grind it. I had wondered if some thing about the hardened drill rod made it more resistant to losing its temper when welded.

    robo hippy
     

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