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tennon and chuck

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Feb 17, 2012
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This may sound like a newibe question but I am looking at a rather fat and scabed lip so I have lost all my pride.
Is it best to have the tennon of a bowl bottom out on the chuck, or have the bottom of the bowl sit on the top of the chuck jaws assuming that you are using almost all of the chuck jaw ( 90%)?
And yes I bought a new face mask and I am considering even wearing it to bed.
Thanks,
Jeff
 
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Ouch!

Is it best to have the tennon of a bowl bottom out on the chuck, or have the bottom of the bowl sit on the top of the chuck jaws assuming that you are using almost all of the chuck jaw ( 90%)?

Hi Jeff - I hope you are okay and will heal fast.

The bottom of the bowl should sit "on top" of the chuck jaws. That's where you get most of your support.

It's also good that you have 90% jaw contact too. You want to get the most jaw contact you can, and still get a good grip on the wood.

But it's imperative that you seat the bowl bottom on the outside edge of the chuck jaws, otherwise you may get a fat lip. :eek:
 
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It's like a standard mortise/tenon joint on the flat side. The shoulder of the tenon keeps it from racking, and if the tenon's too long, it'll never shoulder. Not sure what brand chuck you have, but that's a standard instruction, I should think.

Given the importance of the shoulder, give it as much if not more attention in preparation than the tenon itself. Cut it perpendicular to the axis of rotation, make sure it's smooth - no fuzz - and shaped properly if you have a dovetail on your jaws. The dovetail works like a draw bore on a tenon, wedging the face of the chuck against the shoulder. If you don't have a dovetail, use your tailstock as a clamp and push it up tightly as you tighten.

Oh yes, try not to stand in the throw zone when cutting. Put the tool and the toolrest between your chops and the work and your worst injury on a dismount will be a bruised knuckle.
 

hockenbery

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You did not mention the types or size of the jaws.
#3 jaws give a better grip than #2
The closer the jaws close the better.

As mm says the profile of the tenon has to match the profile of the jaws.

A flat to rest on the top of the jaws and a tenon just a bit under the height of the jaws works best.

It turn my wet wood tenons a 1/2 bigger in diameter than my jaws.
This gives a old grip and allows for shrinkage so a tried tenon in the dried owl will still fit the chuck.

If you are getting catches, a big catch will almost always pull out or break a tenon.
Be sure of your tool usage.
Turn safe
 
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Heal quickly

Jeff,

Others have already answered your question about the proper size and shape for a tenon. I endorse what's been said, but I have a more basic question for you -- why are you using a chuck?

I have several chucks and I like them. However, chucks do NOT hold a bowl as securely as does a face plate. (This is true whether the face plate is screwed to the bowl blank or attached to the blank using a glue block.) Chucks are a little quicker to attach, which is a big deal if you're a production turner. For most of us hobbyists, it's not a big deal at all. The difference in time is the difference in time it takes for the CA glue (if using a glue block) to set up.

When I was first learning to turn, I was taught to use a chuck. So, I quickly bought several chucks. (I also had more than one or two blanks fly off the lathe before I learned how to use my tools properly.) While I enjoyed those turning classes and would recommend them to any new turner, I don't think that the instructors did me a favor by not teaching the proper use of a face plate.


The advantages of using a face plate are several:
  1. A properly installed face plate is the most secure way of attaching a bowl blank to the lathe. (You should still use tailstock support while you can.) For a new turner, one who is more apt to get a severe catch, more secure is a big deal. There's less risk of a fat lip!
  2. A properly installed face plate produces less vibration than does a properly installed chuck. As turners, we learn a lot of tricks to manage vibration so we can get a smooth cut. We use our free hand to "back up the cut", we use a steady rest, or we take lighter cuts than we otherwise might need to take. While these tricks work to some extent, it's better to avoid vibration in the first place by using a face plate.
  3. Face plates run truer than do chucks. Unlike a chuck, once you attach a blank to a face plate, you (almost) never remove it from the face plate until you part the it off. With a chuck, every time you re-mount the project back into the chuck, the blank is apt to be a little off center. That doesn't happen with face plates because you keep the project on the face plate until you're through.
  4. Face plates are far less expensive than are chucks. True, if you are like me, you may have several projects going at once. Which means you might need several face plates, because, as discussed above, you'll be leaving the project on the face plate until you've completed that part of your turning. Still, you can buy several face plates for the price of one chuck.
I encourage all new bowl turners to beg, borrow, or buy a copy of Lyle Jamieson's video: Bowl Basics the Easy Way. He provides an excellent explanation of the advantages of using a face plate.

Note: I've NOT said no one should use chucks for turning bowls or anything else. I am saying face plates have their advantages as do chucks. Using one or the other is a choice. It should be an informed choice.
 
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Bill Boehme

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I would recommend putting a slight dovetail on a tenon when used with serrated jaws. Sometimes I hear turners say to use a straight tenon with that type of jaw, but I take a contrarian viewpoint. The reason is that bottom of the jaws are slightly larger in diameter than the upper serrated portion. If, for whatever reason the tenon gets a little loose int the chuck, the slightly wider end of the tenon may give the operator more time to shut the lathe down before the wood decides to dismount. One other thing is that I always keep the tailstock center in contact with the turning for as long as i am able to do so -- which is typically after most of the interior of a bowl has been turned away.
 
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Also always remember to keep a tightening check on the chuck if your using green wood.Green wood will shrink and loosen the tenon faster then you think.
 
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Also always remember to keep a tightening check on the chuck if your using green wood.Green wood will shrink and loosen the tenon faster then you think.

+1, especially when it may be on the lathe past a couple of hours, or when taking a lunch break. It doesnt get too loose, but you can always get an 1/8 turn or so after that long. Cause maybe your just crushing the fibers but still, it does loosen up with time.
 
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There are many different types of jaws out there that need a different style tennon. My suggestion is you read the directions that came with the chuck. The directions are a wealth of information. Tennon's will vary with manufactures Oneway, Vicmarc, Nova, etc. The instructions generally get pretty specific about tennon's; shape, depth, shoulder etc.

A good friend of my nearly lost his life with an improper tennon. 14hrs of reconstructive surgery with a likely hood of more. You are lucky, it could have been much worse.

Good Luck

Alan
 
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One, try to find the nearest club. That is a huge help, and to date, with my 15 plus years of turning has been my biggest learning experience.

Two, making your tenon or recess the proper size and shape is very important in making sure it doesn't come off the lathe.

Three, learn to stand out of the line of fire when turning. If you turn a lot of wet wood, you will have a racing stripe from floor to ceiling of the water that it thrown off as the wood spins. You don't need to put your nose to the wood.

I will disagree with the statement that a face plate will hold better. Biggest factors in a secure grip is having recess/tenon angles match the jaw angle, having proper size relative to the bowl (bigger is better), and having the jaws coming very close to the size of the recess/tenon so there is more steel on the wood rather than a few points.

robo hippy
 
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Thanks

After reading all of your comments re. my lip rearangement I say thanks.
As I said before I will always wear my face shield when turning.
Jef
 
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