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Bed extension vs. swing away tail stock

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Does anyone have experience using the 18 inch extension to move tail stock out of the way when hollowing? Wondering if it provides adequate clearance, or should I opt for the swing away. Willing to spend the extra money for extension for outboard turning capability, but would rather not buy both.
 
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Luckily the bed extension came with my 3520b. I wanted it mounted on the lower section (so I could turn large platters). That meant I still had to manually take the tailstock off which we know is very heavy. When Powermatic brought out their swing away I got one and it works perfectly even with the bed extension in the lower position, a real back saver.
 

john lucas

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For general turning like bowls and small hollow forms I just move the tailstock to the end of the lathe with my bed extension on. For hollowing larger work I use the Jamieson system and the tailstock is in the way. I've been drooling over the tilt away but drool doesn't turn into money so it's still on the bucket list.
 
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Both Robust and Vicmarc make an outboard turning accessory which will give you a range of diameters that is limited only by your fear of very large spinning objects. These could be easily adapted to bolt on to your lathe, tho it will take a little work i.e. -measuring and fabricating a spacer or two and then drilling and tapping holes in the cast iron legs of your PM.... It just depends on where your imagination says it wants to go with ..."big":D
Here is a link to look at the device. If you look at the Robust site it may show it attached to the tailstock end of the lathe. That would the the configuration on your PM.
https://vicmarc.com/index.php?optio...t_id=166&virtuemart_category_id=21&Itemid=528
 

Randy Anderson

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I have a Jet 1642 and thought about getting the swing away option but they're not cheap. Looked at making one, there are videos on how some have rigged one up, but decided instead to simply make a cradle that sits below the rails on the end of the lathe. I slide the tail stock off and lower it into the cradle. The shaft and live center drop in between the rails. I added an old gate hinge to the side so it can swing out of the way. Mostly just set it down in the cradle when I want it out of the way. The 1642 tail stock is not light but light enough I can easily set it up and down the short distance. I believe the 2020 tail stock is quite a bit heavier than mine so might not be practical for you to lift it up and down even a short distance.
 

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RichColvin

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Jack,

I have the PM3520 and have added the swing away option. I don’t have the bed extension though. I find the swing away option to be a very useful feature, and use it often. Even for small bowls, it is nice to just get the tailstock out of the way, and not have to heave the heavy piece around.

Before getting the swing away option, it had a roll around cart that was designed to take the tailstock off the bed. It worked OK, but this is so much better.

I also have the PowerMatic outboard turning stand, and have used it a few times. It is pretty expensive, and I’m not sure the value is there for that.

Kind regards,
Rich
 
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I also have a PM3520 with the 18" bed extension. I've played around with options but don't like just moving the tailstock out further as I like to stand at the end of the lathe when turning the inside of bowls. I've thought about a swing-away, but the cost is a significant obstacle. Additionally I'm not sure it wouldn't still be in the way if I stand off the end of the lathe (think PM swings so end of lathe doesn't extend out further, but Robust model would push me further out). So I've made a cradle that sits about the same height on an adjacent bench, that way I don't have to lift tailstock up/down; just slide it off and rotate to the cradle...still heavy though...
 
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I have a 3520B with both swing away and 18" bed extension. I purchased the bed extension with the lathe and sits on the shelf under the lathe. It's never been out of the box. I turn mostly bowls and the swing away is used frequently. Your 2020 with the shorter bed would be a harder decision. With the bed extension mounted at bed level on your lathe the maximum distance between head stock and tailstock would only be 3" more than the 3520. I purchased the swing away after an incident turning the inside of a bowl. The tool handle hit the tailstock and the gouge contacted the far side of the bowl. I was fortunate that there were no fingers between the gouge and tool rest when the tool was carried up, over and slammed down on the tool rest
 
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I had a 3520B for several years. The tailstock was heavy enough that I disliked removing it from the bed when I wanted it out of the way. I soon got the swing-away to save my back -- it was a VERY worthwhile purchase. I often turned off the end of the lathe -- the tailstock on the swingaway did not get in my way. Depending on how you work at the end of the lathe, your experience might differ.
I also bought the bed extension. As with Joe Kaufman, it stayed in the box until I sold the lathe several years later.
Given that you have a 2020, perhaps the extra length from the bed extension might be useful sometimes, but at other times you'll likely want to get the tailstock entirely out of the way, and the added length of the extension might not give you all the clearance you want or need
When I replaced my 3520, I included a swingaway on the new lathe as part of the purchase -- I had no desire to wrestle with a heavy and awkward tailstock. I am VERY happy that I included it.
 
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It's gonna depend on how the swing away for your Powermatic is designed and how you want to turn, but in my opinion the only way to get the tailstock out of the way is to get it moved over to the side of the lathe. Moving the tailstock farther down the bed is literally just moving the problem farther down the road, but not far enough that it's not in the way of your elbow/tool handle. And it blocks access to the bed to mount other contraptions like a hollowing rig or steady rest, and a lot of these are easier to install by sliding them on to the ways rather than installing them from above. I have a Nova 1624 and bought their bed extension and swing away. Their swing away is a simple hinge so the tailstock slides on to the bed extension and just swings out behind the lathe, other systems may swing the tailstock out and down. I am delighted with the feature and consider a swing away a high priority accessory for the next lathe. I love being able to get that tailstock well out of the way; it's the only thing I have used the bed extension for.
 
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I have a Oneway 2424 and a 17" extension.
When hollowing, the tailstock comes off, regardless of the extension being on or off.
The Oneway tailstock weighs around 70-lbs - it's good exercise - to my thinking, the swinging tailstock is needless complexity and expense.
 
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I like the AB tilt away set up for the tailstock. However, I have not been able to 'adjust' it so that it can stay on and keep the tailstock on it for bowl turning. Just can't get it lined up perfectly. With my Vic 240, it has a horizontal bar, and combined with the hinge it is on, it swings back into perfect position every time. The outboard turning set up, is a bit cumbersome, so not for production work, and you can't use the tailstock with it, or when pivoted to the 30 degree position. I don't have the tailstock on my Vic. I can still move it around fairly easily.

You know you are a woodturner if you have a hole in your elbow from the tailstock......

robo hippy
 
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I knew I had to do something before I dropped my 3520C tailstock on my foot or wrecked my back again. I couldn't afford $300 for a swing-away attachment, so I built an attachment on a roll-around cabinet that I use for drill press stuff.

3520Tailstock1.jpg 3520Tailstock2.jpg

I just roll the cabinet into place (yes, it clears the air hose) and slide the tailstock onto it, then roll it out of the way. It took about an hour to make and I used stuff I had on hand, so it didn't cost me anything. Not quite as convenient as a swing away, but it works.
 
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Thanks to everyone for the great insight! Lots of “food for thought” here. Thinking I’m going to go with a make or buy approach on a swing way first. Will consider the extension at a later date.
 
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IMG_20201012_115752989.jpg IMG_20201012_115802324.jpg IMG_20201012_115820524.jpg IMG_20201012_120352871.jpg IMG_20201012_120529642.jpg

I have also built a cart, which serves three purposes. The obvious function is to allow me to remove the tail stock without having to lift it (the lathe is a Grizzly G0800, and the tail stock is heavy). I use the Jameison hollowing system, so I built the cart with mounting blocks to store the "capturing" bar on the back of it. This way when I roll the cart over to take the tail stock off, I'm also bringing the capture bar to the lathe. In addition, I don't take up any shelf or wall space with the capture bar when not in use. Finally, I built the cart with drawers which gives me additional storage space.

As far as leaving the tail stock on the swing away when hollowing, it just doesn't work for me, unless I'm doing a fairly short vessel. The HF currently mounted on the lathe extends 12" from the chuck. You can see that the capture bar is all the way at the end of the ways, and the tail stock is in the way of the "D" part of the boring bar. Thus, the cart works well for me and serves multiple purposes, and gets parked in a corner of the shop when not in use.
 
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Ed I’ve always wondered how effective the hinge type of swing away that leaves the tailstock at normal height would be at getting the tailstock out of the way. Does the swing away provide enough clearance for a long handles bowl gouge when hollowing a slightly undercut rim?
 

Roger Wiegand

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I got the long bed AB with the swing away tailstock. For a while I thought I'd made a bad , unnecessary choice, as the tailstock was seldom in the way, but then I started hollowing from the tailstock end and having the swingaway was wonderful. Now I use it all the time and really would not want to be without it.
 
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Kent - the bed on my Grizzly is 48". When I'm doing bowls, I just push the tail stock to the end of the bed, and have never had a problem with it in the way. I suppose it could potentially be in the way when swung around to the side of the bed. I think it would also depend on how much of an undercut you are doing and how long the gouge handle is. On the other hand, if your lathe has a sliding head stock and you move it to the end of the bed, and do the inside of the bowl standing at the end of the lathe, the swing away would not be in the way.
 
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It’s been a long time since there have been replies to this issue but I’ll add my thoughts as they come from a different perspective. I am left handed and find that some things are just a little more of a challenge for someone who works from “the other side.” Though i seldom change the spin rotation, cutting the insides of bowls etc, and hollowing are accomplished from the opposite side. I currently have a Jet 1642 with a swingaway. Couldn’t be happier with it except for me it swings in the wrong direction and can’t be retrofitted to operate the opposite way. Certainly not a manufacturers problem but an obstacle issue for a left handed turner. i understand that the Robust swingaway can be fitted to swing out toward the front of the lathe. One last comment that has been said about those of us who “turn backwards“ is that it can keep you “out of the line of fire.”
 
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For those who leave the tailstock on, removing the center will eliminate the "hole in the elbow" syndrome.

I am fortunate to have a relatively light tailstock and a place to put it on the end table of the adjacent edge sander. Lifting and swinging a Oneway or similar heavy unit would not be good for my old back.
 
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As someone who is Lefthanded, colorblind, ADHD, dyslexic, has dealt with PTSD for years.....

Forget "Left" and "Right". There is no "handedness" in turning - if you seek balance in your skills and wish to make any shape without suffering for being dependent on one hand-dominance. PRACTICE "weak-hand" use. You will find that you will not even notice going from left to right hand cuts after a while. It will become natural to switch hands to accommodate the easiest way to make the cut based on effective body mechanics rather than your dominant hand forcing you to become a pretzel just to make the cut.;):).
FWIW - I have a Robust AB, and love the swing away. I would not want it rotating toward me - as I would find that a trip hazard.
 

hockenbery

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Forget "Left" and "Right". There is no "handedness" in turning - if you seek balance in your skills and wish to make any shape without suffering for being dependent on one hand-dominance. PRACTICE "weak-hand" use
Learning to use either hand forward makes turning easier in so many ways.
In some cases switching the forward hand lets you see the form better or keeps the chips from hitting you.

It takes practice but after a while you switch the forward hand without even thinking about it.

Lots of turners are switching hands with a few months of practice.
There are lots of 20 year veterans who haven’t gotten comfortable switching* forward hands.
 
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Dave Landers

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Forget "Left" and "Right". There is no "handedness" in turning
Learning to use either hand forward makes turning easier in so many ways.

I totally agree. The way I turn most of the time, the body does most of the movement and tool control. I have one hand holding the tool on the tool rest, the other holding the handle against my body. Not much dexterity required of either hand to do that.
There are some cuts where I use more hand control, and those take a bit more practice to switch back and forth.
The way I look at it - the bevel on the wood determines where the handle of the tool needs to be. Then it's my choice which side of the tool I want to stand on. Sometimes that's decided by me wanting to staying out of the line of fire. Sometimes it's so I get a better view of the cut. Sometimes I switch hands just so I don't have to move my body to (for example) cut the other side of a Vee.
 
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Reflecting on Ed Weingarden's reply, another quick option (for future readers) is to get a small, wheeled wire cart like you'd use in the kitchen and use 2x4 stock and some scrap laminate to build ways at the correct height for your lathe. We have one in the studio that holds 2 PM tailstocks. I'll try to remember to take a photo. The extra shelves are handy.
 
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For me, the bed extension and a swing away tailstock don't really accomplish the same thing with regard to bowl turning. The swing away tail stock gets it out of the way to allow direct access to a bowl's interior. Again, for me, it is the best when used in combination with a movable head stock to permit complete access when hollowing a bowl or hollow form. A bed extension is useful, I'm sure, if you turn longer spindles. Since I only turn bowls and hollow forms, the swing away tailstock is, by far, the most functionally useful.
 
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This subject of this discussion is why I have a pivot HS lathe (Nova Galaxi). When hollowing a bowl or HF handheld, pivoting the HS a little and using the banjo, or 120deg or so and using the outrigger gets the TS out of the way, and I dont need to clear off tool holders, etc off the bed to move the HS down.

The outrigger adds all of 5” length to the lathe footprint (unlike a 20” bed extension) and no width. I do have to remove the TS when I use my Jamieson hollowing rig.

I rarely turn anything that wont clear the 16” swing, but the outrigger allows up to 29”. Another advantage is if the piece wont clear the banjo (to move to the other end of the project), the HS is swung out, banjo moved, HS swung back in.

If I had just a sliding HS, the decision would come down to whether I needed a bed ext for larger pieces. The best is to have both ext and swing away if available.
 
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If I were going to try something larger than 20" I would definitely equip my 3520C with an extension which would, I believe, give me capacity up to 38". However, the biggest I've turned to date is around 14", a long way from 20". For the forseeable future I have a lot of room for growth with a sliding head and 20" capacity. Plus, I really like being able to slide the head down to the position which gives me full access to the inside of hollow forms and bowls. I wouldn't trade it for a rotating head, but I understand there are experienced turners on both sides of this issue.
 
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Originally, I bought the Oneway 2436 with an out feed table. After all, they sold it so it must be wonderful!! It wasn’t long that I discovered the need for a tailstock in curtain outboard situations. So I usually moved the piece to the longbed side of the lathe’s headstock anyway. The outfeed table gave you the convenience of unrestricted movement when hollowing out bowls and small hollow forms similar to the swinging headstock. As time went on, I barely used it. It served as a storage shelf. After 18 years of ownership, I discovered that the section could be moved to the rear of the lathe extending the bed an additional 18 inches. Four years later, I am sorry I didn’t do it sooner! Often enough, I can move the tailstock to the end of the bed for many operations without having to remove it.
For my hollowing, the change extended my hollowing range and allowed me to upgrade my hollowing system. I am pleased that I made use of my boat anchor.
I am also glad that Oneway didn’t make the swing away tailstock because I would have bought it with the lathe. I often stand and hollow where the tailstock swing away would be positioned. How would I ever know that when I bought the lathe? Like @Ed Weingarden, I built a rollaway cabinet with a cutting board ways that are level to the lathe bed to store the tailstock when not in use.34B7D7EB-C7C3-41B3-BEEC-E985D80AAE95.jpegE3BC1A73-E48A-490E-AEAB-FCA05E8165B1.jpeg
 
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