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Hollowing Systems

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i know this is an age old thing. I have read many archive post. My current hollowing "system" is a Sorby Hollow Master. I need to upgrade.
I think my needs are for about 12" deep.
I will be able to see systems in KC.

I have seen the Monster articulating arm with some hands on and was impressed, but so far this is the only one I have seen. Monster does not show the capture system on their site, so I guess it is no longer available.
Rough estimate the Monster articulating arm with all the extras is about $800. I think the Jameson capture system is about $550. My price range is $850 or less. I know the Bosch and Gizmo will be in KC, but can't really determine the price range of these system at this time.

For those of you that have both the capture and articulating arm, what do you prefer if you only had one? What other systems should be considered?

I fell that I could build either the capture or articulating arm using the tooling from the purchased system, but that is down the road.
 

hockenbery

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There will be several systems to see in KC

Simon Hope is well worth a look. Find Franck Johansen in the Vantage lumber booth.
He is a Simon Hope dealer.
Trent Bosch will be there - look atTrents demo schedule. Go see his revelations in hollowing demo
Friday after lunch.
Lyle Jamieson will be there.

You can mix $ match
Consider Trent Bosch bars and Simon Hope holder
Or Bosch bars & Jamison holder.
 

Bill Boehme

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I have Steve Sinner's Advanced Lathe Tools boring bar system. Also, his steady rest appears to very good, but I already had the Robust steady rest which is very solidly built. Most of the hollowforms that I have made were less than eight inches deep and were easily done with normal hand hollowing ... no steady rest, no captive bar, no articulating arm, no laser, no video. However, the Jamieson system is the best deal for smaller hollowing systems if you want to do slightly deeper hollowing up to a foot deep. I second Al's recommendation of Trent Bosch.
 
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I just watched the Simon Hope hollowing video and was impresse with the value of that system. I haven't seen much on the fourm about it, but it is definitely high on my list. Thanks for the pointer Al.
 
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I decided on the Simon Hope articulating system for hollowing. I had looked at many systems and there are very good ones available. It came down to $$ and features I wanted. The Hope system is very well made. What I liked about it was you have a hand grip when hollowing. The base can be offset where center post is not directly between the ways. There is also a short articulating arm I'm hoping will give more mobility. One thing I wanted was a camera system being new to hollowing. I bought the complete camera system that included a 3/4" straight, 3/4" curved, round scraper and 6mm Hunter style carbide. In addition I bought the 5/8 "old style" bar with straight carbide cutter and curved carbide cutter. Finally I also got the laser in addition to the camera. The laser has a power supply and not dependent on a battery. I will use the laser until I get close and then switch to the camera. Reason is with the laser you are looking at the piece where with the camera you are looking at the screen and I feel with the camera you can get to the final thickness easier as you can see where the cutter is cutting at all times without adjustment. I have just done one practice piece, but really like the system. Those carbide cutters make short work in removing material. I ordered directly from Simon Hope and I am very satisfied with the transaction. It is a quality product and Simon has provided quick and excellent support to all my questions.

On a side note I have been advised to get a 1" bar. Hope does not offer that size. When I was looking at systems I was strongly considering the Monster system. However when I just went to check out the bar and other options it say the site has not been renewed. Does anyone know if they are still providing products?

IMG_1002.JPG IMG_0739.JPG IMG_0738.JPG IMG_0741.JPG
 
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hockenbery

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I have a Jamieson bar 1 1/8 and
A 1 1/2" bar made by my friend CA Savoy.

Both bars take 1/2" diameter cutter holders and have 3/4" shaft to fit the Jamison bar or the Simon Hope.
CA made me 4 cutter holders. Straight and curved that I use glued in 3/16" cutters and a straight and curved holder tapped for a screw for scraper cutters.
This bar is great to use as the cutters are quickly changed and easily sharpened in their 1/2 holders.

The curved cutters are off center line but work fine in both the Jamison and Hope.

The CA BAR would be easy for any metal worker to make. Cut a 1.5" bar to length. Drill a 1/2" hole in one end, tap that end for 2 set screws, weld a 3/4 piece on the other end. Cut 4 pieces of 1/2 steel, bend 2 at about 45 degrees. Make a flat on the end of a straight and curved piece and tap for a bolt and attach scraper bits. Drill a hole in the ends of the other two and glue in cutters.

I can easily work 12" deep with either and have not done anything deeper than 12"
I use them mostly for hollowing forms up to 17" in diameter.
 
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Hey guys,

i have a short bed on my midi 46-460, most hollowing systems require much longer bed. I am looking into the Elbo with the extension they offer as well as Bosch's stabilizer since it doesn't require additional stand, any recommendation?
 
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Here is one that I made last week for under $100. Camera, tv, and all articulating arm parts. I'm sure that it will fit any lathe, even my 1221.

full-view.jpeg



And that is my 1st ever hollow form.

Regis
 

hockenbery

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The jamieson system works great on short bed lathes.

I demo hollowing on short bed lathes fairly often because that is what some clubs own.
I use a 2x6 a couple feet long. One end is bolted to the ways. The other end has a backrest screwed to it.
I think Lyle sells an extension if you don't have a 2x6
The back rest can be quite flimsy and still work well.
Did a demo a few months back on a jet 1221vs using the Jamison.

Simon hope has a nice System. Turner position with this system is similar to that using the Jamison.

With both the Jamison and the Hope the turner works between the hollow form and the support mechanism.
I find this the most comfortable position for me. This makes them easy to use on full size lathes with good posture. The @Regis Galbach home gown system similar working position.

With the Bosch system the turner works behind the support mechanism. This puts the support mechanism between me and the work which I don't care for. Some people think it is more natural, I think it more awkward.

This distinction is important. I know which I like. You need to know which you like.

One big advantage of the jamieson is you can make the backrest from wood.
A lot lighter to move around and with a little bit of the friction free plastic on the lower rail it is better than metal.

What I like about the jamieson, hope and Bosch systems is that they will work with most hollowing bars.
 
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I emailed both Simon Hope and Lyle about compatibility with short bed. Haven't heard back. Simon states that you need 20" between the opening of the hollow form and the tip of the cutter. Lyle's seems massive and as you said, I would need to build a stand for it as you said. I may look into that.
 
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I emailed both Simon Hope and Lyle about compatibility with short bed. Haven't heard back. Simon states that you need 20" between the opening of the hollow form and the tip of the cutter. Lyle's seems massive and as you said, I would need to build a stand for it as you said. I may look into that.

Hmm I reread Simon's instructions, it says 20 inch from the post not the cutting tip...
 

john lucas

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I use my Jamieson rig on short bed lathes by mounting the secondary tool rest on a wooden support that is off the lathe. At first I didn't think it would work but it works just fine. It would probably work better if I attached it to the lathe with a board or something but it's worked well enough that I have never done that. Here is a photo. You have to look close but you can see the secondary tool rest is sitting in a wooden stand that isn't attached to the lathe.
 

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I use my Jamieson rig on short bed lathes by mounting the secondary tool rest on a wooden support that is off the lathe. At first I didn't think it would work but it works just fine. It would probably work better if I attached it to the lathe with a board or something but it's worked well enough that I have never done that. Here is a photo. You have to look close but you can see the secondary tool rest is sitting in a wooden stand that isn't attached to the lathe.

This thing is huge... Lyle replied and said it fits on mini lathe, I don't see how. I may go with simon's system and may consider getting bed extension for my lathe. My concern is mobility, I move my lathe to turn and an extension may hinder that.
 
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You might want to look at the Elbo system by Tim Yoder. Complete system is 250 and the extension that allows use on mini lathe is 55. I have the regular and love. He also sells laser attachment but I already had the Ron Brown he sells.
http://www.wtwtim.com/elbo tool.htm
 

Bill Boehme

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I've seen various hollowing systems used on mini lathes and they all work as far as I can tell. I've made a few hollowforms on my Jet mini lathe using just handheld hollowing tools ... Scrapers and hook tools (which are cutting tools). I think that these hollowing systems are great ... I have one for deep hollowing on my large Robust lathe where such a system is essential, but for a mini lathe, they aren't a necessity by any means. However, they are nice to have and make the job of hollowing a bit easier on the back plus a laser or camera is another work saver on checking wall thickness.

One downside of a hollowing rig is that you can't use a hook tool with them. Most turners have never used a hook tool, but once you get past having earth shattering catches, they're really a pleasure to use.

Personally, I feel like it would be good to make at least a couple hollowforms using handheld tools before considering getting a hollowing system. This helps develop ones tactile and intuitive feel for the hollowing process and would be advantageous even after getting a hollowing system.
 
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You might want to look at the Elbo system by Tim Yoder. Complete system is 250 and the extension that allows use on mini lathe is 55. I have the regular and love. He also sells laser attachment but I already had the Ron Brown he sells.
http://www.wtwtim.com/elbo tool.htm

I started by looking at the Elbo, I saw that he has an extension for it and saw him demo it at SWAT.
 
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I've seen various hollowing systems used on mini lathes and they all work as far as I can tell. I've made a few hollowforms on my Jet mini lathe using just handheld hollowing tools ... Scrapers and hook tools (which are cutting tools). I think that these hollowing systems are great ... I have one for deep hollowing on my large Robust lathe where such a system is essential, but for a mini lathe, they aren't a necessity by any means. However, they are nice to have and make the job of hollowing a bit easier on the back plus a laser or camera is another work saver on checking wall thickness.

One downside of a hollowing rig is that you can't use a hook tool with them. Most turners have never used a hook tool, but once you get past having earth shattering catches, they're ready a pleasure to use.

Personally, I feel like it would be good to make at least a couple hollowforms using handheld tools before considering getting a hollowing system. This helps develop ones tactile and intuitive feel for the hollowing process and would be advantageous even after getting a hollowing system.

Thanks bill,

I did couple of hollow forms, one is 5x12 spalted and one 7x6 I think more open rim endgrain walnut. The end grain walnut was a pain the deeper I went but got it done. I don't really need hollowing system, but the control and laser would help and if buying one matter as well get a good one, but yes I'm on the fence still.

I need to build a shed and buy full lathe, but we are still deciding if we will stay here or downsize after step kids finish college and move out, both in college now. That will make things much easier for me.

IMG_0310.JPG IMG_0311.JPG
 
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My wife is in charge of the decoration in the house, can't take credit for the setting :) I am never happy with my work, but she finds ways to highlight them and use them around the house.
 
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I decided on the Simon Hope articulating system for hollowing. I had looked at many systems and there are very good ones available. It came down to $$ and features I wanted. The Hope system is very well made. What I liked about it was you have a hand grip when hollowing. The base can be offset where center post is not directly between the ways. There is also a short articulating arm I'm hoping will give more mobility. One thing I wanted was a camera system being new to hollowing. I bought the complete camera system that included a 3/4" straight, 3/4" curved, round scraper and 6mm Hunter style carbide. In addition I bought the 5/8 "old style" bar with straight carbide cutter and curved carbide cutter. Finally I also got the laser in addition to the camera. The laser has a power supply and not dependent on a battery. I will use the laser until I get close and then switch to the camera. Reason is with the laser you are looking at the piece where with the camera you are looking at the screen and I feel with the camera you can get to the final thickness easier as you can see where the cutter is cutting at all times without adjustment. I have just done one practice piece, but really like the system. Those carbide cutters make short work in removing material. I ordered directly from Simon Hope and I am very satisfied with the transaction. It is a quality product and Simon has provided quick and excellent support to all my questions.

On a side note I have been advised to get a 1" bar. Hope does not offer that size. When I was looking at systems I was strongly considering the Monster system. However when I just went to check out the bar and other options it say the site has not been renewed. Does anyone know if they are still providing products?

View attachment 23019 View attachment 23020 View attachment 23021 View attachment 23022

I believe Monster went out of business but others can confirm that.

I decided to go with Simon Hope as well, if I need more space I will get bed extension. Did you find local dealer or did you have him ship it from U.K.? I also plan on getting Trent's cutters.
 

hockenbery

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I believe Monster went out of business but others can confirm that.

I decided to go with Simon Hope as well, if I need more space I will get bed extension. Did you find local dealer or did you have him ship it from U.K.? I also plan on getting Trent's cutters.

Franck Johansen in Sarasota, Fl is a Simon Hope dealer.
He is a distant neighbor. He was at KC an the Florida Symposium.
He is likely busy with the Hurricane clean up and highly unlikely he has electricity yet.
 
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Franck Johansen in Sarasota, Fl is a Simon Hope dealer.
He is a distant neighbor. He was at KC an the Florida Symposium.
He is likely busy with the Hurricane clean up and highly unlikely he has electricity yet.

Is that the same as http://www.advantagelumber.com/ website? I'll contact him.

Hope those in Florida are doing ok. I was talking to Don Geiger on Friday and he said his orders might be disrupted but he should be ok.
 

hockenbery

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Is that the same as http://www.advantagelumber.com/ website? I'll contact him.

Hope those in Florida are doing ok. I was talking to Don Geiger on Friday and he said his orders might be disrupted but he should be ok.
Probably - I don't know the exact relationship Frank has with advantage.
Frank was in the Advantage booth in KC
Also Sarasota club has their meetings in the Advantage lumber building. It is by far the the best place meeting place in Florida. Advantage treats the club to food every meeting.

I'll send you Frank's contact info in a PM aka conversation
 
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I believe Monster went out of business but others can confirm that.

I decided to go with Simon Hope as well, if I need more space I will get bed extension. Did you find local dealer or did you have him ship it from U.K.? I also plan on getting Trent's cutters.

I got mine from Simon in UK before KC. However I did talk to Frank and he said he had a system "in stock". Not sure camera or laser or choice. I got mine from the U.K. In a week.
Not sure why you want Trent's cutters, as Simons work well. Since I am doing smaller HF right now I mainly using the 5/8 bar and his carbide cutters.
Bill
 
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I got mine from Simon in UK before KC. However I did talk to Frank and he said he had a system "in stock". Not sure camera or laser or choice. I got mine from the U.K. In a week.
Not sure why you want Trent's cutters, as Simons work well. Since I am doing smaller HF right now I mainly using the 5/8 bar and his carbide cutters.
Bill

Thanks William,

I liked Trent's demo at SWAT and his explanation of the shape of his hollowing tools, not to mention he is US based for replacement tips. Not that I will turn that many hollow forms, but who knows. I emailed Franck, as Al said he is probably busy with the flooding. I will wait on an answer before I buy the system.
 

john lucas

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John Jordan

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I've seen various hollowing systems used on mini lathes and they all work as far as I can tell. I've made a few hollowforms on my Jet mini lathe using just handheld hollowing tools ... Scrapers and hook tools (which are cutting tools). I think that these hollowing systems are great ... I have one for deep hollowing on my large Robust lathe where such a system is essential, but for a mini lathe, they aren't a necessity by any means. However, they are nice to have and make the job of hollowing a bit easier on the back plus a laser or camera is another work saver on checking wall thickness.

One downside of a hollowing rig is that you can't use a hook tool with them. Most turners have never used a hook tool, but once you get past having earth shattering catches, they're really a pleasure to use.

Personally, I feel like it would be good to make at least a couple hollowforms using handheld tools before considering getting a hollowing system. This helps develop ones tactile and intuitive feel for the hollowing process and would be advantageous even after getting a hollowing system.

You can use my hook tools in most of these. I sell the Elbo for use with mine, I use Lyle's on occasion when doing a LARGE piece, and I also make my 3/4" hooktools to fit the Monster which have a 5/8" diameter end. The problem with most of the tools that come with these various rigs is that when the swivel or angle tips are used, the rigs are in a bit of a "bind" if you will. Not a real big deal, but it does make doing smoothing cuts with a light touch a little more difficult. My hooktool's geometry ensures that the tool does not have any torque on it while cutting, so it won't get into a bind. I think most of these various captured sytems work pretty well, but freehand is a little quicker if you don't have physical issues, but it does require some practice. If you only want to hollow occasionally, they might be for you. Like Bill said, try freehand if you can.

This is not intended to sound like a commercial, but if I could help anyone with advice, you can call or email me.

John
 

Bill Boehme

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It dawned on me that you are probably talking about cutting type hook tools as opposed to "bent" type hooktools like mine. Also I notice that the thread is a year old except for the last two posts, so as they say, "nevermind". :)

The good threads never really die, they just hibernate. :D

Yes, the hook tool that I was talking about looks like a small backwards facing question mark where the cutting edge is along the top edge of the curve. I sharpen it with a diamond cone that is designed to sharpen mortising bits. The most exciting catches I've ever had were when I was still getting acquainted with it.
 
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