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Dumb sanding question - small lidded boxes

Mark Hepburn

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I haven't really done any small turnings before, but want to do some lidded boxes. Probably 3" O.D. and a few inches deep.

So how do those of you who do these turnings sand the interior? Tried the index finger and let's say it's less than optimal. :)

Of course, if I were a really good turner then I probably wouldn't need to sand. But "start at 60 grit" is my motto !!

Anyway, advice most appreciated.

Thanks,

Mark
 
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Can't help with the sanding as I haven't tackled anything like you are turning. Should be several experienced turners reply.
But my father always said the only dumb question was the one not asked.
 
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There are several ways to do this. Forcepts to hold the paper works. Fold the paper if you use finger (carefully) so as not to burn skin. Make a wooden or plastic or heavy foam device to fit contour and use spray adhesive to attach paper. A much more expensive method is sanding stars or make your own with a slotted mandrel to hold strips of paper. Another solution is the Sanding Glove which is velcro covered so just attach paper where you want it.
The extension in drill with 1 or 2 inch pads works for the bottom.
 

hockenbery

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I am with Gerald sanding glove and forceps.

I try to get a clean surface to reduce sanding.

I usually rough out the interior with a spindle gouge,because it is fun and quick.
Then refine the interior with a termite ring tool, hook tool, or Hunter carbide.
I also have a 1/4" bowl (3/8 bar) gouge with a Michelson grind that does a nice job on small,boxes too.
I will usually do some finish scraping with the a Hunter tool at about a 45 degree angle.

60 grit is fine for some things.

If I get a good scrape with the hunter I can sand with 220 and 320 and be some sanding.
 

john lucas

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I hate sanding box interiors. I have always used my fingers. I now use the Hunter #5 for most box interiors. I can get a finish good enough to just touch it up with 400 or 600 grit. My index finger can stand that much sanding. On a good day I don't even have to touch the inside with sandpaper. It does take practice but those tools cut so clean.
I just remembered I have a video showing how to use this tool for boxes. It starts about 5 minutes in but the early parts of the video show how the tool works.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo
If you do larger boxes the back cutting tool that mounts in a Jamieson hollowing rig is fantastic. It cuts with a shear cut, not scraping, as you pull the tool toward you. One of my other video that shows hollowing with the hunter shows this tool.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0v7-HMuCvvM
 
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Mark Hepburn

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Thanks everyone!

DiverJohn, John, Al, Gerald and John:

I just ordered a Hunter #5 (with no handle), a 1" drill/driver sanding pad, a sanding glove and some forceps. I appreciate all your help. After watching John's videos (and also the one on the Hercules tool), I really think I'll like the Hunter. I had a Termite that I liked, but I just couldn't get the thing sharp and sold it here on the forum.

So the plan is to smooth with the hunter, then use the glove and/or drill with the backing pad. I use the 2 3/8" discs from Vince's so they'll be perfect for the 1" pad.

And the forceps for those tight little spaces.

And John, I have to agree - I hate sanding inside boxes with my fingers. Of course, I'm gonna hate paying for all this stuff too, but c'est la vie. :)
 

hockenbery

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If you have some extra time turn a box the beads of courage.
They need to be a bit larger. See the web page below for size and other tips

I know I have mentioned it before but the SWAT beads of courage tables really blew me away.
The incredible work and time and passion that went into those boxes was amazing.

http://www.woodturner.org/?page=2015Charitable

Al
 

Mark Hepburn

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If you have some extra time turn a box the beads of courage.
They need to be a bit larger. See the web page below for size and other tips

I know I have mentioned it before but the SWAT beads of courage tables really blew me away.
The incredible work and time and passion that went into those boxes was amazing.

http://www.woodturner.org/?page=2015Charitable

Al

Al, I for sure will do that. I just followed your link to find out more.

It's ironic you mention that, because a group of us from the company I work for just got back from Memphis this past Friday, where we did a dinner for the kids, siblings, parents and staff from St. Jude and the Ronald McDonald house. The Sky High foundation does a carnival as part of the event. We as a company have been doing this for ten years in concert with a group of folks from Anadarko, but it was my first time and it was genuinely uplifting to interact with these truly brave kids. Life changing and I plan on going back next year.

I think I'll make time for them. And thanks!
 

Mark Hepburn

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Beads of Courage order.

Just ordered 20 logo beads. Have no idea what they look like. But if anyone wants to make a box and use one of them just PM me your address and I'll send you a bead. Or two :)
 
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Thanks for the videos John, I see I've been using the tool completely wrong the few times I've used it :(
just got some Olivewood & Acacia that I plan on making lidded boxes with ..... will definitely give the Hunter another try
I definitely like the cleaner cutting, even tho I've been shear cutting with my gouges and start sanding with 220, the Hunter looks a bit cleaner


I hate sanding box interiors. I have always used my fingers. I now use the Hunter #5 for most box interiors. I can get a finish good enough to just touch it up with 400 or 600 grit. My index finger can stand that much sanding. On a good day I don't even have to touch the inside with sandpaper. It does take practice but those tools cut so clean.
I just remembered I have a video showing how to use this tool for boxes. It starts about 5 minutes in but the early parts of the video show how the tool works.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo
If you do larger boxes the back cutting tool that mounts in a Jamieson hollowing rig is fantastic. It cuts with a shear cut, not scraping, as you pull the tool toward you. One of my other video that shows hollowing with the hunter shows this tool.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0v7-HMuCvvM
 
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Sorry to be late with a response, Mark, but I've recently found a better box sanding method than the middle finger (Hey, Ray Key does it that way) which I think I heard about on this forum. I take a small piece of sandpaper and wrap around a small, folded piece of thick foam. The foam from the cheap floor cushion I stand on is perfect and lasts surprisingly long. Then grab the folded sandpaper/foam wad with a clamp. A curved medical forceps is perfect. You want one that is not too delicate and has the hinge more toward the middle than just at the tip, as you are grabbing something fairly thick. (this one is less than $20 new, $8 models are available) 8in-Curved-Rochester-Carmalt-1.jpg

You have to watch out for the metal tip of the forceps, but with practice you quickly learn the right size of foam and how to tilt the pad to reach the spot you want to work on. It's about 1/3 the time to get a good finish, compared with fingers, and you don't burn or sand off the end of your finger or nail. One of the helpful things about a medical forceps is the ability to 'click' it closed and not have to hold it closed manually.

As a bonus, if someone visiting your shop gets a collapsed lung, you'll be able to take your vaccum tubing and insert a chest tube. Of course, you may need a longer extension cord in order to keep the pump running all the way to the hospital.
 
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john lucas

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Mark. I love what St Jude's does. If I ever win the lottery they are first on the list. Of course I can get there a lot faster in my new porche
 

Mark Hepburn

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Sorry to be late with a response, Mark, but I've recently found a better box sanding method than the middle finger (Hey, Ray Key does it that way) which I think I heard about on this forum. I take a small piece of sandpaper and wrap around a small, folded piece of thick foam. The foam from the cheap floor cushion I stand on is perfect and lasts surprisingly long. Then grab the folded sandpaper/foam wad with a clamp. A curved medical forceps is perfect. You want one that is not too delicate and has the hinge more toward the middle than just at the tip, as you are grabbing something fairly thick. (this one is less than $20 new, $8 models are available) View attachment 8252

You have to watch out for the metal tip of the forceps, but with practice you quickly learn the right size of foam and how to tilt the pad to reach the spot you want to work on. It's about 1/3 the time to get a good finish, compared with fingers, and you don't burn or sand off the end of your finger or nail. One of the helpful things about a medical forceps is the ability to 'click' it closed and not have to hold it closed manually.

As a bonus, if someone visiting your shop gets a collapsed lung, you'll be able to take your vaccum tubing and insert a chest tube. Of course, you may need a longer extension cord in order to keep the pump running all the way to the hospital.

Hey Dean. Thanks, that sounds like a good technique for my new forceps from Amazon. Especially the corner work.

With my luck though it'll be MY lung collapsing and I'll stab myself with the forceps. Auto tracheotomy :D
 

Mark Hepburn

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Mark. I love what St Jude's does. If I ever win the lottery they are first on the list. Of course I can get there a lot faster in my new porche

I hope you win that lottery John! Just load the trunk of that new car with cash and you can be in Memphis in, what, an hour? :D

By the way, I do enjoy your videos. They're clear and very helpful, and your lighting is great
 

Mark Hepburn

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Thanks to all..

Well I tried everyone's advice on sanding small box interiors and found that it was all excellent.

I use a bowl gouge to rough the interior, then that Hunter carbide tool for hollowing and it is great to use (with all due respect Odie, I've gone to the dark side on this one :).

I use the 1" sanding pad and a 2" disc with slots cut in it for some of the work and then the sanding glove and forceps are great for detail work.

I've been able to start most of the interior sanding at 120 or 150 grit, which for me is a true step up in finish.

So I've put up a couple photos of some small boxes I did. They're blatant rip-offs of Keith Burns' boxes but I really like the form and most of my work is derivative at this point.

They're spalted hackberry with a chechen finial on one and the other has a claro walnut lid with cherry finial. Each box is about 2 3/4" O.D. and about 6" tall with finial.

box_burns_01.jpgbox_burns_02.jpgburns2-01.jpgburns2-02.jpg
 
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Well I tried everyone's advice on sanding small box interiors and found that it was all excellent.

I use a bowl gouge to rough the interior, then that Hunter carbide tool for hollowing and it is great to use (with all due respect Odie, I've gone to the dark side on this one :).

I use the 1" sanding pad and a 2" disc with slots cut in it for some of the work and then the sanding glove and forceps are great for detail work.

I've been able to start most of the interior sanding at 120 or 150 grit, which for me is a true step up in finish.

So I've put up a couple photos of some small boxes I did. They're blatant rip-offs of Keith Burns' boxes but I really like the form and most of my work is derivative at this point.

They're spalted hackberry with a chechen finial on one and the other has a claro walnut lid with cherry finial. Each box is about 2 3/4" O.D. and about 6" tall with finial.

View attachment 8402View attachment 8403View attachment 8404View attachment 8405

Very nice looking boxes.
 

Mark Hepburn

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Gerald, thanks for the compliment. And even more for the advice on sanding. :)

Mark
 

john lucas

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Nice boxes. If your having to start sanding the enterior with that course of a grit you need more practice. I use the Hunter #5 most of the time on my box interiors and really almost don't have to sand them. The sides aren't quite as clean as the bottom so I will hit it with 400 or 600 grit and call it quits. Before I started using the hunter tool I hated sanding box interiors. I use it in bevel rubbing mode. I'm don't think I have an example of how to do that in a video but will try to look. Here is one video on how I use the Hunter tool. this video does show how I do boxes using the #4 Hunter but I use the #5 mostly now because it gives less chatter. Also I find when doing the scraping cut coming up the box if you move the handle to the right move it moves the cut from the bottom of the cutter at 6 oclock up the side of the cutter to about 7 or 8 oclock and gives more of a shear scraping cut which is a little cleaner.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo
 

Mark Hepburn

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Nice boxes. If your having to start sanding the enterior with that course of a grit you need more practice. I use the Hunter #5 most of the time on my box interiors and really almost don't have to sand them. The sides aren't quite as clean as the bottom so I will hit it with 400 or 600 grit and call it quits. Before I started using the hunter tool I hated sanding box interiors. I use it in bevel rubbing mode. I'm don't think I have an example of how to do that in a video but will try to look. Here is one video on how I use the Hunter tool. this video does show how I do boxes using the #4 Hunter but I use the #5 mostly now because it gives less chatter. Also I find when doing the scraping cut coming up the box if you move the handle to the right move it moves the cut from the bottom of the cutter at 6 oclock up the side of the cutter to about 7 or 8 oclock and gives more of a shear scraping cut which is a little cleaner.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfp2kvhH6Mo

John,

Great video. I learned quite a few things about how I'm presenting the tool to the workpiece as opposed to how you do it. Gonna practice that tonight for a bit. I have the Hunter #5 and really love it. I'm sure that as I use it more for finishing cuts that I'll find lots more applications for it. I use a bowl gouge for roughing out and then switch to the Hunter.

Thanks also for your help on the photos. I'm going to keep working on that and if you don't mind, send you an occasional photo (but you have my word I won't camp out at your email address with questions!:D)

And yes, I really hate sanding box interiors too. Mainly because it means that I'm not proficient with the tools yet, but also because who really likes sanding, right?
 
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